Submitted by Terence Blackett
WASHINGTON — Conservative commentator Glenn Beck and tea party champion Sarah Palin appealed Saturday to a vast, predominantly white crowd on the National Mall to help restore traditional American values and honor Martin Luther King's message. Civil rights leaders who accused the group of hijacking King's legacy held their own rally and march - AP
Yesterday was the 47th anniversary of the historically memorable – I Have A Dream prophetic speech on the Hill* of the steps of the Lincoln Memorial in Washington, DC. Words which still move the heart, minds and consciences of men everywhere – words, worthy of their rightful place in sacred cannon. But let us not be fooled – like all prophetic utterances, time is still the crucial determinant factor.
In Dr. King’s own words – “We must be careful at this point not to engage in a superficial optimism or to conclude that the death of a particular evil means that all evil lies dead upon the shore. All progress is precarious, and the solution of one problem brings us face to face with another problem. The Kingdom of God as a universal reality is not yet. But just as we must avoid a superficial optimism, we must also avoid a crippling pessimism. Even though all progress is precarious, within limits real social progress may be made. Although man’s moral pilgrimage may never reach a destination point on this earth, his never-ceasing strivings may bring him closer to the city of righteousness…”
On this anniversary of Dr. King’s speech, political demigod, FOX News commentator and Tea Party activist Glen Beck and an army of predominantly Caucasian supporters gathered at the said Lincoln Memorial and sought to upstage the legacy of King’s prophetic historical window in time by “billing itself as “restoring honour” to the US and rekindling what Beck and other speakers saw as the spirit of the American Revolution – family values, low taxation and cutting the Federal deficit.” Beck’s speech was peppered with references to God* and the fact that it was time for American to forge a new direction – “We have had moments of brilliance and moments of darkness. But this country has spent far too long worried about scars and thinking about the scars and concentrating on the scars.”
But what if the “scars” are still visibly offensive? Can we sell the truth – in order that we may purchase and accommodate a lie?
Is this the same guy who called America’s 1st Black President a racist and someone who hates white people? Where is this “reverse speak” coming from? As Goebbels said – “Tell a lie often enough, people will believe it.”
Aug. 28, 2010 Attendees (Beck's Restoring Honour Rally') were discouraged from bringing political banners, so some wore their sentiments on their shirts instead. Nikki Kahn-The Washington Post
Elitist Caucasian Americans have realized that Martin’s Dream is gaining greater traction while on the other hand, many Blacks due to economic uncertainty in these difficult times are developing and “adopting a fatalistic philosophy stipulating that whatever happens must happen and that all events are determined by necessity.”
Dr. King opined in “Shattered Dreams” that “fatalism implies that everything is foreordained and inescapable. People who subscribe to this philosophy succumb to an absolute resignation to that which they consider to be fate and think of themselves as being little more than helpless orphans cast into the terrifying immensity of space. Because they believe that man has no freedom, they seek neither to deliberate nor to make decisions, but rather they wait passively* for external forces to decide for them. They never actively seek to change their circumstances, for they believe that all circumstances, as in Greek tragedies, are controlled by irresistible and foreordained forces. Some fatalists are very religious people who think God as the determiner and controller of destiny…”
Dr. King also suggests that this view is expressed in a verse of one of our Christian hymns:
Though dark my path and sad my lot,
Let me be still and murmur not,
But breathe the prayer divinely taught,
Thy will be done.
King believes that fatalism purports an appalling conception of God for everything whether good or evil is considered to represent the will of God (even racism). He believes a “healthy religion rises above the idea that God wills evil. Although God permits evil in order to preserve the freedom of men, He does not cause evil. That which is willed is intended, and the thought that God intend for a child to be born blind or for a man to suffer the ravages of insanity is sheer heresy that pictures God as a devil rather than a loving Father…”
The power within the “SERMON ON THE HILL” destroys the mythology and the paralysing determinism which King concludes that most of us think we are:
But helpless Pieces of the Game He plays
Upon this Chequer-board of Nights & Days
And that we need not trouble about the future, for
The Moving Finger writes: and, having writ,
Moves on: nor all your Piety nor Wit
Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line,
Nor all your Tears wash out a word of it.
Click on the link as a reminder today of how far we have come and how much further we need to go…
Be blessed!!!
The Tea Party is an arm of the Republican Party.
Unfortunately, it seems to represent a certain section of White America’s uneasiness with a Black president and a call to “turn back the clock”
To hold the rally on that day shows cutting insensitivity and is a slap in the face of the civil rights movement.
I just hope that White America is not sucked in and fooled by the empty rhetoric these people spout and have sense enough to move beyond the unintelligible mumblings of the Palins and Becks.
Some housekeeping, the pictures inserted were selected by BU.
We found the submission to be a good read and entirely relevant.
An interesting movement driven by the Tea Party group is gaining momentum in the US. This movement is comprised of White conservative America. What does it bode for the social and political landscape of America in the medium and long term? The signs on the horizon appear to be dark/ominous.
Isn’t it interesting that the Rev. Al Sharpton, supposedly a Christian minister, NEVER, as far as I know, or have heard, EVER, uses the name of GOD, Jesus Christ, or the Bible, in any of his speeches, in trying or attempting to lift up, or encourage his black folks!
It makes no difference what you say, in using the ‘mantra’ of Dr. King’s ‘I have a dream’ famous speach, IF, you leave out The Lord Jesus Christ, WHO *IS* the Only answer for anyone’s problems, be they racial, economic, or otherwise, it is nothing but a bunch of hot-air, humanistic nonsense, period; exactly what Jessie Jackson and Sharpton have done, and are continuing to do.
Mankind IS on the brink of the most catastrophic CRISIS, ever, in the history of our existence on earth; World War 111, is warming up, all of the players are getting into place, exactly as the Word of God, prophetically proclaims, graver economic depression will unfold, throughout the world of nations, we ain’t see nothing yet, ALL of mamkind will suffer untold misery, white, black, brown, ALL; and Sharpton, comes with keeping the ‘Dream” alive? What Dream? This ain’t no time for that, if Sharpton really understood what dire HELL awaits us around the corner, he would be lifting up the Name of Jesus, to ALL men, as Beck tried to do!
@ZOE
Because Glenn Beck invokes the name of Jesus in his speech doesn’t make him righteous. Why doesn’t he use the name of Jesus in his daily radio and TV shows. Glenn Beck is an opportunist only seeking glory for himself.Be not deceived. God is not mock.
As for Al Sharpton he is and was part of a system that mistreated blacks for hundreds of years. He knows what Hell is all about.
The Dream that Dr. King died for blacks are still struggling to achieve . Al Sharpton is right to reminds us all about it because the doors Dr. King open would close ever so slowly in the blacks face. It is apparent that you would rather see those dreams and aspiration swept away because of the condensending way in which you attack Mr. Sharpton. While on the other hand giving the Racist Glenn Beck a pat on the back. just a reminder Birds of a Feather Flock Together
@ac
To use the parlance of Techie and GP that was a vicious bodyline bouncer.
Whew!
To quote Glen Beck:
“America to forge a new direction – We have had moments of brilliance and moments of darkness. But this country has spent far too long worried about scars and thinking about scars and concentrating on the scars”.
—————————————-
There are some who might say the moments lasted a long time…perhaps too long and cast a dark shadow. They might add the times of worry were not long enough, thus the long dark days and nights; while some thought about scars and concentrated on scars…others carried not only the scars but the “pain” of them, what a luxury it would have been only to concentrate on and think of them.
I think MCTV could fill the FOX spot with CNBC Africa.
In understanding the behavior and thinking of the psycopathic racial personality. It is that personality disorder, that has led the largest force immigration in the history of the world. Perhaps though, more significant tan the force migration of countless Africans, from their homeland in Africa, was their treatment at the hands of so called christians, and the failings of organized religion. In order to understand, the several hundred years of mistreatment at the hands of the enslavers, one only needs to look at the present day generation of european descendants. If most of us can in essence, through history understand the behavior of the colonizers, then perhaps we can understand, the mission and the focus of the “Founders of the Tea Party.” The psycopathic racial personalities, have been undaunted in their desire to totally remove non-whites from the face of this planet. Those like Glen Beck , Sarah Palin, Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh, continue to foment an assiduous speech pattern, geared at the bible belt, religious right wing, who are seemingly engaged in mass disatisfaction. In order for Dr King’s dream to be fully realised in the USA, it would warrant a shift in white male anger. If white men embrace anger, black men will inherit disdain and absolute misfortune. Today in America, it must be noted that there’s enough blame to pass around, guess who gets all of that blame? You got it, black, and hispanics. White men are angry at us for being here, for taking their jobs, and most of all because there’s now a black president. I believe that although Dr King’s dream will stand the test of time, America has never and probably will never be mature enough to confront the facts of that most profound dream. If America had perhaps entertained or flirted with the idea of true democracy, they would have found in the mix of democracy was a racially color blind society. Just for a minute consider living in a country, whose constitution, still permits black people to be three fifths of a person, now look at how three fifths becomes relevant, as far as pay goes, and laws are enacted. Blacks account for thirteen percent of the population in the USA, yet we receive sixty percent of the dollar, in pay, there goes that 3/5 law. We make up thirteen percent of the population, yet approximately almost sixty percent of the prison incarcerant population, 3/5 law. Don’t begin to suggest to me then, that there is not something fatally wrong with this constitution.
❖ We Can Make It Better ▣ Kanye West, Q-Tip, Talib Qweli, Common
❖ Dr. Martin Luther King Speaks
❖ My Prayer ▣ Featuring Illinoise
❖ Ghandi Speaks
❖ Road To Zion ▣ Damian Marley & Nas
❖ Walk Like A Warrior ▣ Featuring Dead Prez
❖ Black Steel In The Hour Of Chaos ▣ Public Enemy
❖ The Message ▣ Featuring Cassidy
BTW Glenn Beck a person who claims to be knowledgeble on current affairs as he prostelyese his rabid racist comments about the President says he was unaware that the day he chose to have his propaganda speech reclaiming america was the day that DR. Kin g made his speech. Who he thinks believe that lie . Now one can add LIAR to his profile. Glenn Beck is not even fit to untie DR. King shoes fartherless to stand on the same podium.
Thank God that Dr. Alveda King, the niece of the late Dr. Martin Luther King, who was on the other side of things, was mature enough spiritually, to see and understand what the TRUTH of the matter really is, and it ain’t got nothing to do with COLOUR!
Her comments were: “I have a dream,’ Martin Luther Jr’s niece declared, “that America (ALL PEOPLE) will pray and that God will forgive US (White, Black, et al) our SINS and revive our land.” emphasis added.
As Beck also said: “It has nothing to do with politics; it has EVERYTHING to do with GOD.” emphasis added.
Those of you who are STILL colour blind, will never understand what Dr. Alveda King, understood and said, and the seriousness of what Beck was trying to say to ALL Americans!
Zoe
I must agree with you that it is indeed interesting that the Rev. Al Sharpton, supposedly a Christian minister, NEVER, as far as I know, or have heard, EVER, uses the name of GOD, Jesus Christ, or the Bible, in any of his speeches, in trying or attempting to lift up, or encourage his black folks!
You see “Black Theology” (whatever that is) has nothing to do with Christ.
Dr King over the years has been projected as a Moses, but I have never been impressed that King was sent by God to deliver blacks or anyone from anything. Oh yes he made a famous speech many years ago and he is a famous black icon in the USA , but did his message really uplift blacks in a persistent perennial way?
On the other hand I can point you to blacks in Barbados whose economic, spiritual and other situations have advanced considerably from abject poverty over the last 40 years since their acceptance of the gospel. And yes there are also many blacks in Bim whose lot has improved in the same time period without their accepting the gospel message.
What is clear is that Dr. King’s ‘I have a dream’ famous speech is not as effective as the Gospel message, because 47 years later blacks in the USA are not much better off. They are still engaged in the most heinous crimes against FELLOW BLACKS. American blacks are still some of the most ignorant blacks in the world, despite the great opportunities available to them. Our own Bajan blacks have advanced considerably more in the same period despite not having much less opportunity.
You see, the “Black Gospel” spewed out by Jessie Jackson and Sharpton and those of that ilk, does very little to
answer for anyone’s problems, be they racial, economic, or otherwise, it is nothing but a bunch of hot-air, humanistic nonsense, as Zoe opines.
Zoe is again very correct when he points out that “ Mankind IS on the brink of the most catastrophic CRISIS, ever, in the history of our existence on earth; World War 111, is warming up, all of the players are getting into place, exactly as the Word of God, prophetically proclaims, graver economic depression will unfold, throughout the world of nations, we ain’t see nothing yet, ALL of mamkind will suffer untold misery, white, black, brown, ALL who have not accepted the claims oif the Lord on their lives.
Sharpton must be excused for trying to keep the ‘Dream” alive, because he knows nothing else, and that is how he earns his bread and better. It is very doubtful that he could make a living anywhere else with that idle empty chatter ? What Dream what? This Dream of which he speaks is very limited in its purpose or practicality.
For those who think that being mistreated by whites is hell, you obviously have no idea of what hell –as described by Jesus- is! I put it to you that Al Sharpton does not know what Hell is all about….yet!
If King had died for preaching the true gospel of Christ, he would be a true hero to me, because he would have died for something real. He would have died that the men to whom he preached would BE JOINT HEIRS WITH CHRIST as taught in Romans 8:18. He would have died that blacks would be able to take their place around the glassy sea with whites and folk of all hues. Now that is something worth giving one’s life for.
It seems that Dr. King died for nothing! It seems that he died in vain! Since “the Dream that Dr. King died for blacks are still struggling to achieve.”
Jesus died for blacks too, but his death is sufficient and efficient for all that would believe. Now you may not believe that, and you may mock me to scorn. But it is true that WHOM THE SON SETS FREE THEY ARE FREE INDEED! Free from the slavery and bondage of the power of sin. Those blacks that received the benefits of Christ’s death are free ! They have the peace of God in their hearts, and the peace that passeth understanding! (Romans 5; Philippians 4).
What is it that the blacks for whom King died have exactly? Are blacks not still being mistreated in the USA? Do not BLACKS mistreat BLACKS? Is it not true that blacks receive as much if not more mistreatment from fellow blacks in the USA? What is Al Sharpton doing about this?
Does Al Sharpton has the power to open any dorrs for anyone? Is he interested in opening doors for anyone.
Exactly what dreams and aspirations does Al Sharpton or Jesse James…..er Jackson has for black Americans? How effective are they in doing anything major for blacks in the USA?
How is it that Glenn Beck is a racist opportunist and Al Sharpton or Jesse James…..er Jackson are saints? Do you not think that Sharkton and Jesse James are not opportunists who are only seeking glory for themselves too? Perhaps, if these two had the interests of blacks really at heart, and if they were true ministers of God with the Spirit in their “sails” , they would have achieved much more, and received the glory they seek. They would have obtained more than photo ops.
Now lets say a few words about Glenn Beck.
Re Because Glenn Beck invokes the name of Jesus in his speech doesn’t make him righteous. No it doesn’t. But it does make the so called religious minister look bad. And his righteousness might very well be the cause of his invoking the name of Jesus in his speech.
Note that ones righteousness is imputed to one by Christ as is the clear teaching of Romans 4, and none of us has the right to decide who is righteous or not. Cf 2 Peter 2:9
He is no more glory seeking opportunist than any one else. He admits on his show that he is not too smart and that he is a recovering alcoholic. He has apparently met the Lord Jesus.
The result of this is that he has become a sincere seeker. I watch his show and am impressed by the history he presents, and agree with him that if we do not know or history we are prone to repeat it. It is indeed true that what men learn the most from history is that THEY DO NOT LEARN FROM HISTORY
He has been pointing out and correctly so that when economics and government merge there is chaos, and that when the state and church coalesce there is trouble.
Beck is not really a clever speaker nor a great teacher, but he has been effective enough in articulating his message to gain a great following which is ominous. If Beck was a great coherent articulate speaker, all hell would break loose, because he certainly has a medium to get his message out…………and it is going out.
Beck is wise enough, or God has shown him what is coming down on America. While Sharkton and Jesse James dreaming Beck seems to understand that the ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT THAT HAS BEEN IN PLANNING STAGES AND FOR WHICH THE EXECUTION HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR THE LAST FORTY YEARS IS NOW RAPIDLY COMING TO FRUITION.
Some one has probably taught him in his local church that USA must be destroyed and engulfed as a wimp in the nations of the Kings of the West or the revived Roman empire. He is seeing more that the average church goer in the pew in the USA. And he is trying to say that, while he mocks the ‘Anointed One” chosen to implement this. But Beck is going about it the wrong way.
They are a few well read Eschatologists who are doing it , but largely the church in the USA and much of the world is fast asleep and need to read and study 1 Thessalonians 5.
The problem with many, is that they can not, or will not remove their shades. THEY CAN ONLY SEE IN SHADES OF BLACK VS WHITE, rather than RIGHT VS WRONG.
The US now has a black President (black only because when you mix white with black you just don’t very often get white- in fact you rarely do!). So every thing that he does is right to BLACKS. And this is just not so. You may say the whites think that all he does is wrong because he is black; but just remember that he could not have become President with the black vote alone. Did he deceive the whites? Has the lot of blacks improved with this so called black President? Be not deceived. God is not mocked! For what soever a man soweth that shall he also reap!
Obama sowed deception. He sowed to the wind, do you not think that he will reap the whirlwind?
ac,
You’re right, because Martin Luther King message was anti-raccist.
Because the US ecomomy has not mended in 18 months, they are blaming Obama. Somehow they have discreetly forgotten that this whole meltdown was caused by the Republicans.
Zoe
The Truth of the matter is that Beck is too late! The horse has left the stable lon long ago.
America and Americans like most of the world is so much caught up in the throes of the cosmos diabolicus that they can not see that it is passing away.
Yesterday Beck was much like Lot prior to the destruction of Sodom & Gomorrah, or like the pre diluvean civilization. If Beck was a politician….he wasted a wonderful opportunity yesterday.
Those who can see or have spiritual discernment will see that the “Annointed One” is suffering from a series of Ahithopel moments. He has choseren himself a number of persons to carry out his mission, but God is chabging thier counsel to naught. They are giving bad counsel. God does not need Glenn Beck or Hannity or Sarah Pailin to make the First and last Black President look inept, inadequate, inefficient interalia. God has turned the counsel of Obama’s ahithopel’s to naught!
They are not getting one decision right. e.g Health care is in a mess!
@GP,
Your belittling of Black Theology and Dr. King is like speaking from a wellspring of ignorance.
How can you denigrate a man who sacrificed his life to see the advancement and enfranchisement of his people (and by extension, the harmonious relatlionshiips of all)
The man was so great that the White American estabishment made a holiday in favour of his life and death. What holiday was named in honour of you? What have you done on the behalf of Blacks or anyone for that matter?
Black theology – the mode, method and ehthos of sermon delivery. This is what kept Blacks on firm ground.
Only he who wears the shoes is qualified to speak.
Peace
@Dr GP
Very well said sir! Very well said.
All of the wonderful, good work, that Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr, et al did throughout the terrible era of racial segregation, and yes, it did break many inhuman bondages imposed on blacks, was only one part of the LIBERATION, that the black man/woman needed, as does the white man, whose bondage like the black man, is SIN, which has NO colour; just manifested in different cultural ways, which IS the focus of what Dr. Alveda King, was trying to get across to ALL America.
Al Sharpton et al in the civil rights movement, obviously fail to understand this CORE problem.
Mankind, regardless of COLOUR, in in terrible BONDAGE, in slavery to SIN, and no amount of so-called civil rights, or any other rights, can truly set anyone free from this slavery, ONLY the Lord Jesus Christ can set the white man, the black man, or any other shade of colour, free from this worldwide slavery!
The Con vs Lib ideologies find their way to BU.
It seems Terence is correct about the fatalistic bent of our people.
The fact of the matter is MLK was a civil rights advocate, he died delivering that message. The symbol for which he stood for and the reality of it still resonates across the globe decades after his death is testimony to his mark.
Have Blacks and other minorities achieved to the levels MLK would have wanted? No but he continued the journey started by others and it is up us to run with the baton. Instead we retreat to ideologies which only seek to obfuscate the issues.
Up Ye Mighty Race – All Will Be Fine – Friends For Life
Now the Guns are all ablazing. Never heard or seen Glenn Beck in any marches or made any speeches about the injustices of The Blacks.
His only claim to fame is of recent after he supposedly sober up and became a Talk show Host.,
What has Glenn beck done in all his years on this earth to futher the cause of any one but himself with is foolish self righteousness of quoting the bible.
Al Sharpton and Jessie have all been in the trenches day ande nioght seeking political and social injustice for all blacks and rightly so.Now comes along that Johnny come lately Glenn Beck with his band of racist trying to turn back the hand of time and using the name of God to do say and in so doing is even furturing dividing the country. They are a million and one churches all over the world and the message of Jesus and God has been preached worldwide . Nobody needs such a nincompoop to tell them about Jesus. What de hell does he know. A political yardfowl for the Republican Party.
Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson did the right thing yesterday that is to show respect to DR. King in their specches. Let Freedom RING! LET FREEDOM RING ! That is the real Message and legacy of Dr, Martin Luther King and he died trying to achieve it.
What de hell is Glenn Beck going to die for .Absolutely nothing. Just hiding behind the veil of Jesus. Glenn can’t hold a candle to Dr, King.
Robert
Theology is by definition the study of God.
What is black theology Sir? The study of a Black God?
I have the right to choose my heroes Sir. And Christ is my hero. I reserve the right not to bow down and worship and hold up any MAN whether BLACK WHITE OR BLUE!
My hero is the GOD-MAN the LORD JESUS CHRIST.
May I ask you Sir, Oh fount of knowledge . ML King sacrificed his life to see the advancement and enfranchisement of his people (and by extension, the harmonious relatlionshiips of all), and the result to day is exactly what ???????
I prefer to hold up Jesus Christ of whom we are told in 1 Timothy 4 :10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.
You see CHRISTS DEATH WAS SUFFICIENT- it was for ALL MEN not only black men
And it IS STILL TODAY EFFICIENT to all those who believe.
King’s death was neither SUFFICIENT OR EFFICIENT
Re The man was so great that the White American estabishment made a holiday in favour of his life and death.
Are you saying that the naming of a holiday for a man by THE WORLD SYSTEM whether it be the white establishment or any man made system makes a man honorable. I don’t want a day or holiday in my honor Sir. I want to meet Jesus face to facer in his heavenly kingdom.
Re What have you done on the behalf of Blacks or anyone for that matter?
Do I have to keep repeating it Sir Oh fount of knowledge and wisdom.LOL.
Re Black theology – the mode, method and ehthos of sermon delivery.
Sir By definition a sermon has a Scriptural text, which is correctly exegeted by proper hermeneutics. It has a body and a conclusion all in a proper and coherent sequence.
Are you saying then that all Blacks who preach deliver their sermons by hooping and hollering and talking racists epithets and jargon?
Are you saying that Blacks who do not preach in that way do not preach?
Are you suggesting that I should lower myself into the mire to preach in that way.
Tell me Oh wise one, if this so called BLACK THEOLOGY is so effective iniots methodology and ethos WHY IS IT SO INEFECTIVE?.
Do you really think that that junk really keeps blacks on firm ground, or is it that you have had a resection of part of your cerebral hemispheres.
Do you think that you can teach a respected Theologian and preacher about ethos and method of preaching, because you gave a PC and internet access?
David
Re The fact of the matter is MLK was a civil rights advocate, he died delivering that message. The symbol for which he stood for and the reality of it still resonates across the globe decades after his death is testimony to his mark.
So what? The Lord Jesus Christ died to pay for the sins of men, and that message resonates across the globe CENTURIES after his death is testimony to his mark. WHY MUST I CHOSE AN INFERIOR HERO WHO COULD NOT DIE TO SAVE ME? OR CHANGE ME OR THE LIVES OF FELLOW BLACKS OR ANY ONE ELSE I KNOW? What Black Theology what!
Re Have Blacks and other minorities achieved to the levels MLK would have wanted? No but he continued the journey started by others and it is up us to run with the baton. Instead we retreat to ideologies which only seek to obfuscate the issues.
This is a load of racists emotional clap trap. None of us who are blacks get any thing for being black. I have never got anything because I was black! I have lost many opportunities to work because I am black, however. What ideologies is obfuscating the issues David.
Will you get a discount in town tomorrow because you are black? What benefits have you ever got for being black. What is this dream? BLACKS HATE BLACKS AND TREAT THEM LIKE DOGS.
BLACKS MURDER BLACKS
BLACKS STILL SELLING OUTBLACKS FOR A PRICE
Tell me about this dream. If Blacks cant relate to themselves how will they coexist with others?
@GP
Who is telling you to chose?
Until the God you worship comes people living on the earth have to deal with the issues as they unfold.
Perhaps while on earth living amongst mere mortals you have mastered the art of hibernation?
“Christ Death was Sufficient and today is still Efficient
“Kings death was neither Sufficient or Efficient”Not True .
However after much humming and hawing the white establishment reluctantly gave into naming a holiday after DR. King.
Dr king died trying to pave the way for the down trodden and mis begotten . In some ways both men had tofight the political system and both gave their lives doing so. So to say that Dr. King legacy is not sufficient or ineffecient is ridiculous. No Greater Love Has No Man Than This than a Man who has Laid Down His Life For His Friends. Both Jesus And DR, King did just That. and to deny that is an unforgivable truth
To put King’s death on the same plain of Christ is of course blasphemy.
The verse from Romans five here misquoted actually refers to Christs dying Do Read the context of the chapter where Christ is compared to Adam , and note the key word “MUCH MORE>” LOL
Never heard or seen Glenn Beck in any marches or made any speeches about the injustices of The Blacks.
WHY SHOULD HE MARCH OR MAKE SPEECHES ABOUT INJUSTICES TO BLACKS
His only claim to fame is of recent after he supposedly sober up and became a Talk show Host.
AINT THAT GREAT? GOD CAN CHANGE A DRUNKARD, AND GIVE HIM A GREAT JOB AND MAKE HIM FAMOUS AND KNOWN ALL OVER THE WORLD
What has Glenn beck done in all his years on this earth to futher the cause of any one but himself with is foolish self righteousness of quoting the bible.
We do not know what Glenn beck done in all his years on this earth to futher the cause of any one but himself but we know what the Bible says about FAITH BELIEVING AND NOT WORKING . AINT IT SWEET. David calls it obfuscating ideology LOL
3. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
4. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
5. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
AINT THAT GREAT? GOD CAN CHANGE A DRUNKARD, AND GIVE HIM A GREAT JOB AND MAKE HIM FAMOUS AND KNOWN ALL OVER THE WORLD. JUST BECAUSE HE BELIEVES! Tell me that I wrong here. LOL
foolish self righteousness of quoting the bible.??? SEEMS TO BE WORKING FOR HIM DOESN’T IT. HOW DO WE KNOW HE IS SELF RIGHTEOUS. THE MAN SAID HE REPENTED OF HIS SINS AND BELIEVED GOD. WHAT MUST HE QUOTE ‘THE DREAM?” LOL
Al Sharpton and Jessie have all been in the trenches day ande nioght seeking political and!social injustice for all blacks and rightly so. THEY HAVE TOILED ALL NIGHT AND CAUGHT NOTHING THEY HAVE TOILED ALL NIGHT AND CAUFGHT NOTHING
Now comes along that Johnny come lately Glenn Beck AND GOD GAVE HIM A HIGH PAYING JOB AND A MEANS OF GETTING HIS MESSAGE OUT LOL
with his band of racist trying to turn back the hand of time and using the name of God to do say and in so doing is even furturing dividing the country.
EVERYONE THAT DISGREES WITH THE PRESIDENT IS A RACIST I RACIST TOO LOL
AND NO BECK CANT TURN BACK THE HAND OF TIME ITS TOO LATE
NEXT IS THE RAPTURE
THEN ANTICHRIST
THE GREAT TRIBULATION and then ARMAGEDDON
They are a million and one churches all over the world and the message of Jesus and God has been preached worldwide . Nobody needs such a nincompoop to tell them about Jesus. What de hell does he know. HE KNOWS WHAT HE HAS READ AND BEEN TAUGHT VERY INTERESTING HISTORICAL INFORMATION IS GIVEN ON HIS SHOW. HE SEEMS TO KNOW A LOT AND IS RELATING IT TO THE WORD. HE JUST NEEDS MORE TEACHING .LOL
THE FACT IS AMERICANS ARE SLEEPING AND DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT HAS HAPPENED AND WHAT HAS BEEN HAPPENING IN THEIR SCHOOLS AND COLLEGES FOR 40 YEARS
THE AMERICA CHURCH IS SLEEPING THEY HAVE NOT BEEN BELIEVING OR TEACHING THE SECOND COMING called an obfuscating ideology by David LOL
A political yardfowl for the Republican Party.
IF THAT IS SO WHAT SIN HAS HE COMMITTED?
What de hell is Glenn Beck going to die for .Absolutely nothing. HE IS A SMART MAN WHY SHOULD HE DIE?
Just hiding behind the veil of Jesus.
CAN YOU THINK OF A BETTER PLACE TO HIDE? I CANT! LOL
Glenn can’t hold a candle to Dr, King.
DOES HE NEED TO?
KING IS DEAD!
BECK IS STILL ALIVE AND HE HAS A BETTER MEDIUM THAN KING EVER HAD AND ON A DAILY BASIS ah lie? LOL
THE ONLY SAVIOR THAT HAS DIED THAT STILL LIVES IS JESUS CHRIST.
BECK IS A MESSENGER. He need not die. LOL
This is so much fun.
Debunking emotional junk on BU.
@ David
Who is telling you to chose?
EVERYMAN MUST CHOSE SIR. ITS CHRIST OR ANTI CHRIST. cf 2 Thessalonians 2. Its very clear.
Until the God you worship comes people living on the earth have to deal with the issues as they unfold.
Hurrah David. YOu are a rocket Scientist! That is why Christians ARE OCCUPYING TILL HE COMES1 THEY ARE WAITING WATCHING SOME TIMES WEEPING and engaging in Spiritual warfare – they are WARRING 1 Thes 5 and Ephesians 6
Perhaps while on earth living amongst mere mortals you have mastered the art of hibernation? NO I have sought to MASTER AN UNDERSTANDING OF THE WORD AS IT RELATES TO THE TIME IN WHICH WE LIVE.
Listened to a young man this morning teach on Joel and relate it to I thes 5 and 2 Peter 3:9 . He spoke on the IMMINENT DAY OF THE LORD…………….not the stuff the Black Theologians teach about. LOL
Hear the word of David .. the prophet (not the King and shepherd though)
Until the God you worship comes people living on the earth have to deal with the issues as they unfold.
My dear David, dont you think that Theologians like me know this. Have you not discerned how Zoe and I often relate the ISSUES AS THEY UNFOLD TO WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES.
Have you ever heard Hal Lindsay or Jack Van Impe do the same? LOL
Isnt it funny that whereas the Black Theologians do not appeal to the Word of God or the Christ of the Bible, that “the Johhny come lately Beck the recent drunkard” can try to appeal to Americans to return to that which made them great? AND THAT WAS GOD a Constitution based on the WORD of God!
[Do you know that Dr Colin Hidson used to teach on hikes that George Washington nicked a lot of thier constitution from a document signed ay Austin's bar in Oistins when he visited Barbados to see his sick brother. Note the English pronounced Austin's as Oistins..... hence the name.] Thats just an aside.
Have we learnt anything ?
NO
Wuh de schools duh teach sain ?
de schools aint teaching nuttain
What have you refuted or debunked. You have come with the same old same old mouthings trying to defend the racist Glenn Beck . If he be a follower of Christ he need to be Christ like . Christ never taught hate or used code words such as “Taking Back America” Neither did DR. King teach hate. I wonder who took america away from Glenn Beck. but then again he has been drunk for so long neither he nor his racist band of merrymen can figure that out.
What is your point about Dr. King being Dead. You can killed the messenger but can’t kill the message. However both Jesus and King are dead and their message still live on ah lie!
Btw Glenn Becks message would only live on for a couple days , No one wants to hear that racist crap. His Sin is that of poisining the minds and hearts of his followers . Jesus got his message throughout the world without the help of mass media .Wheras Dr King even though there was mass media in his time he had limited acess to it . Glenn Beck might have all the media acess but only those who support his racism would listen.Glenn Beck would sooner become yesterday news.
Glenn Beck should be ashamed of quoting the bible and spouting his garbage .
If he knows his history so well . How come he says he didn’t know or convienently forgot the day of Dr . Kings Speech can you answer that? He is a drunking fraud prepetrated on the american people at a time when the Nation is looking for healing . What de hell is Glenn Beck doing seeking to Divide and Conquer in the name of politics
LOL
The Democratic party so hates and fears Beck they fired a woman in BU style! And then had to eat crow. THEY ADJUDICATED WITHOUT THE FACTS! LOL
You obviously hate Beck. What happen does he pose a problem to the ” Anointed one” the first BLACK President? LOL
Now I love that the President is doing the job that he was set up to do. I want to see him suceed at it LOL
Jesus loves drunkards!
CI Scofield was a drunkard too But his reference Bible is the number one refereence Bible sold around the world! LOl
How Jesus loves drunkards. He loves Beck too. Look how he has promoted him. That cnt be debied LOL
GP
If my memory serves me, you have stated that you rarely comment on issues and persons about which you know nothing or very little about. This is wise advice. So with regard to your comments about Dr Martin Luther King @6:53 I can only advise you to follow your own counsel.
Dr King did not put himself up as a saviour or the saviour. He was simply a courageous fallible human being who fought (along with many, many others) against a complex, immoral and destructive system of racism and oppression of those not included among the clique of the powerful. I am not aware that Dr King espoused any “Black” theology. He was a Baptist minister, educated at Morehouse College, Crozer Theological Seminary and the Boston University School of Theology. It was mainly from his education and chosen vocation as a Christian minister that Dr King sought to challenge America and by extension the world to redress the many wrongs to minorities. It is best to read what Dr King wrote:
“A voice out of Bethlehem two thousand years ago said that all men are equal. It said right would triumph. Jesus of Nazareth wrote no books; he owned no property to endow him with influence. He had no friends in the court of the powerful. But he changed the course of mankind with only the poor and the despised. Naive and unsophisticated though we may be, the poor and the despised of the twentieth century will revolutionise this era. In our “arrogance, lawlessness and ingratitude” we will fight for human justice, brotherhood, secure peace and abundance for all. When we have won these- in the spirit of unshakable non violence- then, in luminous splendour, the Christian era will truly begin.”
Concluding paragraph of the essay “A Testament of Hope” published posthumously on 16 January 1969.
I implore you not to wallow in your own defeat and failings, content to wait for some salvation while cynically denigrating those who labour with true faith as commended to us in James 2: 14- 24 .
As a matter of fact hen Glenn Beck tv program first started i used to watch it.until he become the pompous racist jacka.. .
Dr . Martin luther King fought many a battle against the establishment .Today segregation has been outlawed. People are free to live in any neighbourhood of their choosing with limited exceptions.They are still many hurdles which blacks have to overcome , But to have Glenn Beck Standing on the very spot that Dr. King gave his famous Speech and wrapped himself in the american flag with the Bible on the other side is derogatory to say the least. Two sides of the same coin .ONE side seeks PEACE. The other side seeks disharmony… You Choose.You should know them by their FRUITS.
MLK unlike many theologians of today went out amongst the people to seek to be an agent for change to promote what he believed was right and just. He did so at great sacrifice to his family, friends and himself paying with his life. Many of our modern theologians prefer to jet around in private jets, extorting fees to deliver flowery speeches and to preach from pulpits adorn with crystal and and other adornments. Jesus Christ must be squirming wherever he is on the mountaintop as he surveys the chaos and lament about those who have sought the comfort of resigning to the fate of prophecies to be unfolded. If half the theologians had the belief, conviction and charisma of MLK to confront the vicissitude of this world, it would be a hell of a place as we wait.
Don’t worry GP, it is the ignorant masses of this world who in their uneducated way will have to seek the way, the truth and the light.
I have never suggested that Dr King put himself up as a saviour or the saviour….. BUT OTHERS SEEM TO THINK THAT HE WAS and that he was A MOSES ..Is it not true that that is how some think?
What I said, and what I know is that he IS NOT THE SAVIOR OR MY SAVIOR. So he means absolutely nothing to me. And I think I reserve the right to think so. This is my life. Do I have to think like others Sir? LOL
I note that you say”. I am not aware that Dr King espoused any “Black” theology.” But don’t many of his followers teach it? Or are you not aware of it either?
This is what you wrote that Dr King wrote I want you to tell me where it is written that Jesus said that “all men are equal” or that “ right would triumph”? Please cite book chapter and verse. Thank you.
I want you to tell me where it is written that Jesus said or implied that “In our “arrogance, lawlessness and ingratitude” we will fight for human justice, brotherhood, secure peace and abundance for all. When we have won these- in the spirit of unshakable non violence- then, in luminous splendour, the Christian era will truly begin.” ”? Please cite book chapter and verse. Thank you. Then tell me what kind of Theology that is Sir?
What does the Scripture teach about the advent, or basic teaching of the Christian era or the Age of Grace or the Dispensation of the church Sir. Please teach me Sir?
What do you know about my defeat and failings? And does not true Theology teach repeatedly that believers wait for not some salvation, BUT THE BLESSED HOPE ) Greek elpis better translated ASSURANCE)? And do you really understand what James teaches about faith in James 2: 14- 24 . Are you saying that the only way to express faith is by dying for blacks? Did Martin Luther die for blacks? What about George Mueller of Bristol? Or the several missionaries who were murdered while really expressing their faith in presenting the Word of God. Does James teach believers to exhibit their faith by giving their lives for blacks?
Now go and read the text you cited again and see what it says. Perhaps your interpretation is Black Theology? LOL
The Scriptures teach that novices must not try to teach the Word. Obviously you have neither searched or studied. Let me see if I have an essay on James 2:14-24 from 1999
Here is my essay on a subject that you think you can teach me on.
“Dead” Faith Cannot Keep A Christian Alive (2:14-17)
Keeping in mind the concept of “saving the life by obedience,” we can
now look more closely at James 2:14-17. James writes:
What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has
faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? If a
brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, and
one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and
filled”, but you do not give them the things which are
needed for the body, what does it profit? Thus also faith by
itself, if it does not have works, is dead (Jam. 2:14-17).
Can the fact that a man holds correct beliefs and is orthodox “save” him
from the deadly consequences of sin? Of course not! The very thought is
absurd. That is like giving your best wishes to a destitute brother or sister
when what they really need is food and clothing (2:15-16). It is utterly
fruitless!
As a matter of fact, this kind of callous conduct on the part of one
Christian toward another is precisely what James has been warning
against (see 1:27; 2:2-6)! It superbly illustrates his point. Such idle words
are as “dead” (ineffectual) as a non-working faith! So James says, “Thus
also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead” (2:17).
It needs to be carefully considered why James chose the term “dead” to
describe a faith that is not working. But the moment we relate this term to
the controlling theme of “saving the life,” everything becomes plain. The
issue that concerns James is an issue of life or death. (He is not
discussing salvation from hell!) The truth which he has in mind is that of
Proverbs: “As righteousness leads to life, so he who pursues evil pursues
it to his own death” (Prov. 11:19).
Can a dead faith save the Christian from death? The question answers
itself. The choice of the adjective “dead” is perfectly suited to James’s
argument. Just as the idle words of some ungenerous believer cannot save
his brother from death in the absence of life’s necessities, no more can a
non-working faith save our lives from the deadly consequences of sin.
An Objector Speaks (2:18,19)
In 2:18-19 James introduces the words of an imagined objector.6 The
entirety of these verses belong to the objector. The response of James
only begins in verse 20. This is shown by the words, “But do you want to
know, O foolish man . . . ”
The literary format James uses here was familiar in ancient times from the
Greek diatribe. The diatribe was a learned and argumentative form of
communication. The two phrases (“But someone will say” [verse 18], and
“But do you want to know, O foolish man” [verse 20]) clearly show that
the diatribe format is being employed. These two phrases bracket the
words of the objector in verses 18, 19. Elsewhere in the New Testament,
this same format appears in 1 Corinthians 15:35, 36.8
Since the statements in verse 19 about the belief of men and demons are
the words of the objector – not of James! – their use by commentators to
make a theological point is totally misguided. But what does the objection
mean? Since most Greek manuscripts read the word “by” in place of the
familiar word “without” in verse 18,9 the objector’s statement may be
given as follows:
But someone will say:
“You have faith and I have works. Show me your faith
from your works, and I will show you, from my works,
my faith. You believe that there is one God; you do
well. The demons also believe, and tremble” (Jam.
2:18, 19, Greek).
The argument which these words express appears to be a reductio ad absurdum (a reduction to absurdity). It is heavy with irony.
“It is absurd,” says the objector, “to see a close connection between faith and works. For the sake of argument, let’s say you have faith and I have works. Let’s start there. You can no more start with what you believe and show it to me in your works, than I can start with my works and demonstrate what it is that I believe.” The objector is confident that both tasks are impossible.
The impossibility of showing one’s faith from one’s works is now demonstrated (so the objector thinks) by this illustration: “Men and demons both believe the same truth (that there is one God), but their faith does not produce the same response. Although this article of faith may move a man to ‘do well,’ it never moves the demons to ‘do well.’ All they can do is tremble. Faith and works, therefore, have no built-in connection at all. The same creed may produce entirely different kinds of conduct. Faith cannot be made visible in works!”
No doubt James and his readers had heard this argument before. It was precisely the kind of defensive approach a man might take when his orthodoxy was not supported by good deeds. “Faith and works are not really related to each other in the way you say they are, James. So don’t criticize the vitality of my faith because I don’t do such and such a thing.”
James’s reply (2:20) may be paraphrased: “What a senseless argument! How foolish you are to make it! I still say that without works your faith is dead. Would you like to know why?”
Verses 21-23 are James’s direct rebuttal of the objection. This is made clear in the Greek text by the singular form of “do you see” in verse 22. This shows he is addressing the objector. Only with the “you see” of verse 24 does James return to the plural and to his readers as a whole.
Justification By Works (2:20-24)
In refuting the objection he has cited, James selects the most prestigious name in Jewish history, the patriarch Abraham. He selects also his most honored act of obedience to God, the offering of his own son Isaac. Since in Christian circles it was well known that Abraham was justified by faith, James now adds a highly original touch. He was also justified by works!
James writes:
But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without
works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by
works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? Do you
see that faith was working together with his works, and by
works faith was made perfect? And the Scripture was
fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was
accounted to him for righteousness.” And he was called
the friend of God (Jam. 2:20-23).
Earlier in this discussion we said that we can best understand James’s point of view by recognizing his harmony with Paul. That is extremely relevant here. James does not wish to deny that Abraham, or anyone else, could be justified by faith alone. He merely wishes to insist that there is also another justification, and it is by works.
Of course there is no such thing as a single justification by faith plus works. Nothing James says suggests that idea. Rather, there are two kinds of justification.
This point is confirmed by a careful reading of the Greek text of verse 24. When he returns to his readers generally, James says, “You see then that a man is justified by works, and not only [justified] by faith.” The key to this understanding is the Greek adverb “only,” which does not simply qualify the word “faith” but the whole idea of the second clause. James is saying: Justification by faith is not the only kind of justification there is. There is also the kind which is by works.
Somewhat surprisingly, to most people, the Apostle Paul agrees with this. Writing at what was no doubt a later time than James, Paul states in Romans 4:2, “For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something of which to boast, but not before God.” The form of this statement does not deny the truth of the point under consideration. The phrase, “but not before God,” strongly suggests that the Apostle can conceive of a sense in which men are justified by works. But, he insists, that is not the way men are justified before God. That is, it does not establish their legal standing before Him.
In responding, therefore, to the kind of person who tried to divorce faith and works in Christian experience, James takes a skillful approach. “Wait a moment, you foolish man,” he is saying, “you make much of justification by faith, but can’t you see how Abraham was also justified by works when he offered his son Isaac to God?” (2:21). “Is it not obvious how his faith was cooperating with his works and, in fact, by works his faith was made mature?” (2:22). “In this way, too, the full significance of the Scripture about his justification by faith was brought to light, for now he could be called the friend of God” (2:23).
The content of this passage is rich indeed. It is a pity that it has been so widely misunderstood. The faith which justifies – James never denies that it does justify! – can have an active and vital role in the life of the obedient believer. As with Abraham, it can be the dynamic for great acts of obedience. In the process, faith itself can be “perfected.” The Greek word suggests development and maturation. Faith is thus nourished and strengthened by works.
It would hardly be possible to find a better illustration of James’s point anywhere in the Bible. The faith by which Abraham was justified was basically faith in a God of resurrection. Referring to the occasion when that faith was first exercised, Paul wrote:
And not being weak in faith, he did not consider his own body, already dead (since he was about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb. He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God, and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform (Rom. 4:19-21).
Abraham had confidence that the God he believed in could overcome the “deadness” of his own body and of Sarah’s womb. But it was only through the testing with Isaac that this faith becomes a specific conviction that God could literally raise a person from the dead to fulfill His oath.
Accordingly, the author of Hebrews declares:
By faith Abraham, when he was tested, offered up his only
begotten son, of whom it was said, “In Isaac your seed
shall be called,” concluding that God was able to raise him
up, even from the dead, from which he also received him in
a figurative sense (Heb. 11:17-19).
Thus the faith of Abraham was strengthened and matured by works! From a conviction that God could overcome a “deadness” in his own body (=inability to beget children), he moved to the assurance that God could actually resurrect his son’s body from literal, physical death. In the process of carrying out the divine command to sacrifice his beloved boy, his faith grew and reached new heights of confidence in God.
In this way, too, the Scripture that spoke of his original justification “was fulfilled.” That statement (Gen. 15:6) was not a prophecy, of course. But its implications were richly developed and exposed by the subsequent record of Abraham’s obedience. Abraham’s works “filled it full” of meaning, so to speak, by showing the extent to which that faith could develop and undergird a life of obedience. Simple and uncomplicated though it was at first, Abraham’s justifying faith had potential ramifications which only his works, built on it, could disclose.15
And now he could be called the “friend of God,” not only by God Himself, but also by men (cf. Isa. 41:8; 2 Chr. 20:7). This is in fact the name by which Abraham has been known down through the centuries in many lands and by at least three religions (Christianity, Judaism, Islam). Had Abraham not obeyed God in the greatest test of his life, he would still have been justified by the faith he exercised in Genesis 15:6. But by allowing that faith to be alive in his works, he attained an enviable title among men. In this way he was also justified by works!
When a man is justified by faith he finds an unqualified acceptance before God. As Paul puts it, such a man is one “to whom God imputes righteousness without works” (Rom. 4:6). But only God can see this
spiritual transaction. When, however, a man is justified by works he achieves an intimacy with God that is manifest to men. He can then be called “the friend of God,” even as Jesus said, “You are My friends if you do whatever I command you” (John 15:14).16
The Scriptures teach that novices must not try to teach the Word. Obviously you have neither searched or studied. Let me see if I have an essay on James 2:14-24 from 1999
David
Your theology is at variance with what the Scriptures teach. The NT teaches that WE ARE TO TEACH THE WORD NOT GO AND PROMOTE WHAT WE BELIEVE IS RIGHT AND JUST
WE ARE NOT TAUGHT TO BE AGENTS OF CHANGE BUT TO PRESENT THE WORD
DAVID SIR IT IS THE LORD THA T DOES THE CHANGING
IT IS GOD THAT DOES THE WORK
Please kindly note that those preachers our “modern theologians” who prefer to jet around in private jets, extorting fees to deliver flowery speeches and to preach from pulpits adorn with crystal and other adornments WILL ALSO GET THEIR REWARDS FROM THE RIGHTEOUS JUDGE WHO IS THE ONLY DISCERNER OF HEARTS.
Jesus Christ must be squirming wherever he is on the mountaintop as he surveys the chaos and lament about those who have sought the comfort of resigning to the fate of prophecies to be unfolded.
Your below the belt scoffing is noted, but all TRUE BELIEVERS OF GOD’s WORD ARE RESIGNED AND COMFORTED BY THE PROPHECIES OF CHRISTS COMING AS THE SCRIPTURE ADMONISHES! IT IS A MAJOR TEACHING SIR
Note I Thessalonians 4:14-18 teaches . Note verse 18 says that it is a CONFORTING HOPE!
Note that a very large portion of the Bible is prophecy. Bet you didn’t know that.
And much of it is now set to be fulfilled. If you didn’t know Sir. NOW YOU KNOW
14. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15. For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17. Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18. Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
Note also that there is no reason at for all the ignorant masses of this world who in their uneducated way to remain ignorant, or uneducated in these matters . JESUS SAID I AM THE WAY THE TRUTH AND THE LIGHT.
The ignorant and uneducated can read the New Testament and read about salvation in the SAME WAY THAT THE LEANED AND EDUCATED CAN. In fact Sir it is usually the ignorant and uneducated who do so? Ah lie? But the Bible teaches that God will accept some rich and some learned folk. Note the word ANY in verse 26 It is one of my favorites. LOL
23. But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; 24. But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26. For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
23. But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; 24. But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26. For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
David
No Sir
Jesus Christ IS NOT squirming as he surveys those who have have sought the comfort of resigning to the fate of prophecies to be unfolded.
Re If half the theologians had the belief, conviction and charisma of MLK to confront the vicissitude of this world, it would be a hell of a place as we wait.
NO ACTUALLY IT WONT MAKE NO DIFFERENCE
MEN HAVE HISTORICALLY REJECTED GODS WORD AND HIS PROMISES
THEY DIDNT LISTEN TO NOAH
THEY DIDNT LISTEN TO LOT
THE FOLK IN THE WILDERNESS DIDNT LISTEN TO MOSES
THE FOLK IN SAMUELS DAY DIDNT LISTEN TO HIM
THEY DIDNT LISTEN TO THE PROPHETS
THEY DIDNT LISTEN TO JESUS WHEN HE WAS HERE EITHER Ah lie?
Check it out David. Uou will find that I am correct LOL
Did Al Sharpton, in August, 2010, with America on the brink of economic failure, taking the world with it, in any way appeal to Americans, whose moral abyss, disguisting secular materialism, and godless life styles, call the nation to PRAYER, asking God to forgive ALL men, heal and restore the country? NO! NO! NO!
What did Sharpton do? Was there any meaninful substance in his address on the MLK memorial day, that would go to the CORE of America’s problems, across the entire spectrum of human need?
NO! NO! NO!
Glen Beck, on the other hand, went back to the foundation on which America became the greatest nation EVER, notwithstandings its terrible failures, and what exactly was it? A foundational, deep, and abiding belief in Almighty God, His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, which ultimately gave rise to the abolition of slavery, etc, etc., AND, because America has TURNED away from these foundational, spiritual principles, IT IS FAILING in every which way, so, Beck, sincerely, as best he could, called on AMERICA, to turn back to the ONLY ONE who made her great in the first place, and PRAY for forgiveness, healing and restoration.
Instead of acknowledging this, the ‘Leftist’ here on BU, in the absence of any objective, coherent, reflection, launch ugly, nasty, ad hominem attacks on Beck, myopically fixed on RACE, colour, failing utterly to see and understand the bigger picture, and the TRUE AGENDA of the wicked, evil, World Order elite, who control all American policy, of which, Clinton, Bush, and now Obama, who happens to be black, is just another puppet, like all the others!
Ignorance, ( lack of knowledge) is a terrible thing!
GP
despite your claim to coming first in English at school, you couldn’t pass a common entrance exam in comprehension! You may start now about your exhibition, degrees etc…yadda yadda!
1 Timothy2: 1-7. Christ gave himself for ALL men. If you cannot accept that Christ treats all men as equal then this may explain your petulance.
I take it that you believe that injustice and wrong will triumph.
After reading your “essay” it is evident that it will be almost impossible to teach you anything.
Zoe
Your problem is that you dont have the belief, conviction and charisma of MLK to confront the vicissitude of this world! LOL Bare with me I haD TO SHARE THAT JOKE ON YOU. lol
Were you taught that as a preacher you should have charisma? Is that what they taught you in Homiletics class? Or did they teach you to hide your self behind the Word?
Man you expect too much of Sharkton and Jesse James.
Poor Beck tried to use his charisma and the little he knows to share his beliefs, and convictions to confront the vicissitude of this world and he is branded on BU as a drunking racists that would ddivide the people. He is also a Republican.
I shared my beliefs about what the Bible teaches about the prophecies of the eschaton and I am mocked and told that I have mastered the art of hibernation, and to have sought the comfort of resigning to the fate of prophecies to be unfolded.
To do as the word dictates has always been a case for mockery by unbelivers though What is new LOL
I have had great fun tonight. This is more entertaining than sUNDAY NIGHT TV.
wHEN THE bAR RAISER TURNS UP TOMORROW FRO HIS EXTENDED sABBATH — YOU KNOW THESE IMPOSTORS NOW WORSHIP ON BOTH SATURDAY AND SUNDAY, THE FUN WILL REALLY BEGIN.
I asked you to give me the text where it says that Jesus said that all men are equal, not the fact that he gave himself for all men.
Those are two different concepts. They are not in any way equal.
I said nothing to support your allegation that I believe that injustice and wrong will triumph. What did Jesus say about it is what I asked you.
But I suppose that you have not noticed that injustice and wrong IS INDEED triumphing in this world- the cosmos diabolicus. Aren’t you guys quibbling about it on BU everyday? LOL. It will continue so to be UNTIL HE COMES TO USHER IN THE MILLENIUM!
Re After reading your “essay” it is evident that it will be almost impossible to teach you anything.
YOU GOT THAT RIGHT. YOU CANT TEACH ME ANYTHING ABOUT THAT TEXT BECAUSE YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT THE TEXT IS SAYING. LOL
For those who may be interested in another perspective of the Christian life, the following is shared with readers. It is taken from the following website. In my opinion it refutes the apathetic “we can’t change anything so just wait for the Lord” nonsense that GP preaches .
http://lavistachurchofchrist.org/LVSermons/WhenGoodMenDoNothing.htm
“Edmund Burke once said, “All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.”
A. In the endless battle between good and evil, it is seldom the numbers that determine the outcome of each skirmish.
B. Many times, the side for the right has beaten overwhelming odds
C. More often evil wins simply because the good men are not willing to stand up and fight for what they know is right.
II. When Good Men do Nothing, They Get Nothing Good Done
A. To be good, one must do good
1. Luke 6:35 – Do good, expecting nothing in return
2. Eph 2:10 – We were created to do good works
3. Tit 2:14 – Christ gave himself to gain a people zealous of good works
B. The parable of the one talent man
1. He took what the Lord gave and hid it – Matt 25:18
2. He was condemned for returning only what his Lord gave – Matt 25:25
3. He did not do any outright evil. He did not steal the money. Neither did he do anything good with the money. He did nothing. – Matt 25:26
C. The church at Sardis seemed to be alive, but it was dead – Rev 3:1
D. Too many churches and Christians do nothing.
1. They are standing idly by. They are mere spectators, sitting on the sidelines instead of actively participating in the good work.
2. If good wins, they join in the celebration, though they did nothing to produce the victory.
3. If evil wins, they complain long and loud, though their own apathy produced the undesirable result.
E. Learn from the parable of the fig tree – Matt 21:19
1. What will the great Judge do with those who claim to be good and yet do nothing?
2. Heed the warning of John, the baptizer – Matt 3:10
3. Jesus too, gives the same warning – John 15:1-2
III. When Good Men do Nothing, Evil Triumphs.
A. Evil, sin, and sinful men must be opposed. God commands that the good are not to just avoid evil, but to actively oppose it.
1. Eph 5:11 – Have no fellowship, but reprove them.
2. Those who do nothing about sin and evil help sin and evil to prevail.
3. Ezek 3:18 – When one is silent before the evil, we become a partaker with them
B. Elijah challenged the people to decide between God and the evil of Ahab and Jezebeel, yet the people remained silent – I Kings 18:21
C. In the parable of the good Samaritan, wicked men had robbed and beaten a man, leaving him half dead. The men who did this were very evil. The priest and the Levite, who passed on the other side (Luke 10:31-32) were willing to let evil triumph by not doing anything. Only the Samaritan stood up for what was right.
D. In the fight against evil there is no middle ground, no gray area, no neutrality – Matt 12:30.
IV. When Good Men do Nothing, They are no Longer Good
A. Too many have the mistaken notion that good is merely the absence of doing wrong.
1. A person is not good merely because he has done no evil.
2. A good person is one is actively working for what is good – I Pet 3:11
3. When we do not do good, we are sinning – James 4:1
B. Reuben, the eldest of the sons of Israel, knew his brothers’ plot to murder Joseph was wrong.
1. He started an attempt to rescue Joseph, but while he delayed, his brothers sold Joseph into slavery.
2. When Reuben found out what had happened, he realized that his inaction helped to bring. Instead of correcting his error, he covered his guilt by agreeing with his brothers to lie about Joseph’s disappearance – Gen 37:29-33
3. Reuben had good intentions. He was not present when Joseph was sold into slavery, but his inaction and absence made him just as guilt. His guilt haunted him the rest of his life – Gen 42:21-22
C. Obadiah condemned the Edomites for doing nothing when evil befell their relatives, the Jews – Obad 11
D. There are Christians today who fail to face the real foe of error and fight the enemy. Instead, they turn inwardly upon their own brethren and brutally attack out of bitterness and hatred.
1. Well did Paul warn about these spiritual cannibals – Gal 5:15
2. Some in their envy of others will provoke Christians, taunting them to misstep so they may feel justified – Gal 5:26
3. While the actions of these Christians are shameful, what about those who stand by and do nothing? If you stand aside and do nothing while your brothers are being slandered, are you any better?
V. Those who fail to do are sowing dangerous seeds – Gal 6:7
A. Do not allow evil to triumph by your inaction.
B. Stand up and be counted. Speak up against evil, rebuke evil men and their wicked ways.”
I am thankful for the work of Dr Martin Luther King and the many other Christians and non-Christians throughout history who laboured to improve the human conditions of this world.
The domination of nation to one nation cause complications so those are the things that the youths have to see in this time because they are strong physically mentally and spiritually. No youth is supposed to ask any other youth what should he do, he should know, because every youth that comes in this time is created with a consciousness that is more than his parents or his parents parents and he is supposed to be conscious enough to know what he should have done or what he should be doing, seen.
- Peter McIntosh’s Philosophy -
@GP
You are betraying the position we have taken. Will not belabour this point because we have discussed it at length in the past. What is the sense of teaching the word if the style or mode of delivery does not resonate with your audience? This is where MLK was superior, a great communicator he was. The reference to change agent was not about changing people but moreso adopting a style which is conducive to people wanting to switch from a heathen lifestyle that which is righteous i.e. a style which tillates their interest, a style on would use to boys on the block, or a bad boy in prison.
BU does not generally scoff (we try to appreciate all views) and you would not feel so if you did not try to make these discussions about you or Zoe and you versus the rest. You know the BU household holds you in high regard and appreciate your support to date, yet we have had to turn the other cheek with your continual disparaging of BU i.e. visiting for laughs or timeout etc. By your own words the one and only the omnipotent will be the one to judge so why do you, Zoe and others constantly berate others for holding different religious beliefs? Why not show leadership on BU by engaging allcommers and let the onlookers learn from the exchanges and decide for themselves?
Thanks for the link, Anonymous at 11:26 pm. Very thought provoking.
Well well well……and we wonder how the World get so?!?
ReLIEgion!!
Everybody wants to go to Heaven but nobody wants to die.
Brand New Crisp Biscuit
Danger Zone ☣
❖ Danger Zone ▣ Sugar Minott
❖ Dub For Everyone ▣ Jah Shaka Meets The Firehouse Crew
❖ Try Me Dub ▣ Gregory Isaacs
❖ Dangerman Version ▣ Ja-Man Allstars
Category:
GP said BU is the place he come to get his comedy…that is so true. This from Zoe has to be the joke of the Millennium….
.’Glen Beck, on the other hand, went back to the foundation on which America became the greatest nation EVER, notwithstandings its terrible failures, and what exactly was it? A foundational, deep, and abiding belief in Almighty God, His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, which ultimately gave rise to the abolition of slavery, etc, etc., AND, because America has TURNED away from these foundational, spiritual principles, IT IS FAILING in every which way, so, Beck, sincerely, as best he could, called on AMERICA, to turn back to the ONLY ONE who made her great in the first place, and
Instead of acknowledging this, the ‘Leftist’ here on BU, in the absence of any objective, coherent, reflection, launch ugly, nasty, ad hominem attacks on Beck, myopically fixed on RACE, colour, failing utterly to see and understand the bigger picture, and the TRUE AGENDA of the wicked, evil, World Order elite, who control all American policy, of which, Clinton, Bush, and now Obama, who happens to be black, is just another puppet, like all the others!
Ignorance, ( lack of knowledge) is a terrible thing
Lord help them!!
I guess when the KKK were hanging our brothers and raping our sisters in the name of God….it was ok.
@ Dr. GP
1Cor.13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
………………………………………………………………………………………………………
Dr.
Perhaps this verse could be applied to most of the those who are trying to ridicule you in this discussion.
Christ also warned us that some of us would have eyes but would not see and have ears but would not hear!
OFFTOPIC
Policeman killed in shootout with police.
http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/Policeman-killed-in-shootout-with-police
Technician
I see that you are back! Hope you did well in your exams.
Two things. You don’t have to die to go to heaven. Some folk will have the privilege of going to heaven without dying. Cf Emoch Genesis 5:24, Elijah
See also I Thessalonians 4:13-18 & I Corinthians 15:51-57
Jesus also taught this concept in John 11.
You are again engaging in your sport of trying to debunk what Zoe said.
I am sure that you know that many persons from Europe fled to America because of religious persecution, so that they could exercise religious freedom.
It is true to say that America is the only country that claim to have be developed on the basis of the Word of God. It is therefore true to say that the foundation on which America became the greatest nation EVER, notwithstandings its terrible failures, was A foundational, deep, and abiding belief in Almighty God, His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ
It is true to say that because America has TURNED away from these foundational, spiritual principles, IT IS FAILING in every which way
These are all undeniable facts, just are the fact of slavery and the KKK. And ZOE DID SAY THAT AMERICA HAD ITS FAILINGS!
It is also true to say that the need is for America to return to God according to the tenets of 2 Chronicles 7:14.
It is true to say that Glen Beck , who has apparently recently found Christ , but is a poor articulator of his faith sought to wake up America to their need to revert to the principle taught in 2 Chronicles 7:14.
Here is the principle Sir.
13. If I shut up heaven that there be no rain, or if I command the locusts to devour the land, or if I send pestilence among my people; 14. If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
It is true to say that It is true to say that certain posters on BU have not given Beck the benefit of the doubt, but in their OMNISCIENCE they “in the absence of any objective, coherent, reflection, launch ugly, nasty, ad hominem attacks on Beck, myopically fixed on RACE, colour, failing utterly to see and understand the bigger picture, and the TRUE AGENDA of the wicked, evil, World Order elite, who control all American policy, of which, Clinton, Bush, and now Obama, who happens to be black, is just another puppet, like all the others!
I suggest to you that there is much merit in what Zoe has said. It might not accord with the views of the majority . But it is sound argument.
This is my problem with BU. Often times folk are expressing the correct view , and are unnecessarily laughed to scorn. You will now come and say ‘How does one know what is the correct view, or a reasonable opinion?” I leave you to judge that for yourself.
But Zoe is not wrong because he defended Beck whom some think is anti Obama. Who is actually doing a very good job of FURTHER steering the American ship of state aground. The Healthcare system is a blatant example. We can discuss this in due course.
David
I repeat
The NT teaches that WE ARE TO TEACH THE WORD NOT GO AND PROMOTE WHAT WE BELIEVE IS RIGHT AND JUST
The WORD IS SHARPER THAN ANY TWO EDGED SWORD
The reason why the American blacks are not liberated, is because teachers of Black Liberation Theology DO NOT TEACH THE WORD OF GOD.
GOD CAN OVERCOME THE DEFICIENCIES OF ANY TEACHER BECAUSE IT IS THE WORD NOT THE TEACHER THAT MATTERS. God can make the hearer hear.
Yeah David MLK was, a great and superior communicator and DEAD! It is vey easy to whip up a crowd into a frenzy. I can do that on BU now with very little effort. I just have to tell the truth LOL
Re The reference to change agent was not about changing people but moreso adopting a style which is conducive to people wanting to switch from a heathen lifestyle that which is righteous i.e. a style which tillates their interest, a style on would use to boys on the block, or a bad boy in prison.
WELL SIR DAVID THE PURPOSE OF TEACHING THE WORD IS TO CHANGE HEARTS. IT IS TO CHANGE PEOPLE. OK IT CHANGED MARTIN LUTHER AND ZWINGLI AND THE REFORMERS.
It has changed countless millions David. And Moody and others were not sweet talkers nor WAS JESUS OR PAUL OR PETER OR JOHN OR JAMES. Read the NT and you will see.
David I want you to know that my style and mode of delivery in teaching is accepted everywhere else but on BU. But you know what they say about a prophet in his own country. LOL
Re you would not feel so if you did not try to make these discussions about you or Zoe and you versus the rest.
David I am not stupid. These discussions are about denigrating the clear teaching of the Word that Zoe and I have sought to bring to BU It is clearly Zoe and I vs the rest. Yesterday Zoe brought a correct view, and the morons were off and running. They did not try to see any merit in what he was saying….and he was quite correct. See my response to my buddy Technician above. Now Techie is a persistent and perennial mocker of Zoe.
David I try to tell the truth at all times. And it has reached the point where I know visit laughs or timeout etc. Because my vision of what BU should be or can be is a mirage. Because of lack of moderation, it is a free for all. And I will call a spade a spade. I am tired trying to show leadership on BU by engaging allcomers and let the onlookers learn from the exchanges and decide for themselves?
And whereas folk are welcomed to their own religious views what the Bible teaches is quite clear! It is black and white.
Why do you presume to tell me the methodology I should use, and why do you believe that the BU family want to learn anything? Or the truth?
What on earth is Black Theology for example? Or Black Liberation Theology? How come this nonsense is only taught in the USA? Has these blacks a need for liberation more than others?
The Bible is taught in Africa, and the underground Church is strong because they face the same suffering that the early church faced. It is a danger to be a believer in say Nigeria. In the USA where the black church members are fat and face no danger, there is a load of nonsense taught by a few charlatans who are really in truth politicians fleecing their flocks. Have you ever read of the black Baptist pastor Lyons who sold out his denomination to the undertaking business?
The Bible is taught to blaks in the Caribbean but I have never heard any Black Liberation Theology in any of the Carribean countries where I have lived. Don’t Carribbean blacks want liberating too?
What about the UK where the Bible is taught to folk of African descent?
David
Did you read this junk below? Now you understand why I visit for laughs.
Anonymous | August 30, 2010 at 12:01 AM |
For those who may be interested in another perspective of the Christian life, the following is shared with readers. It is taken from the following website. In my opinion it refutes the apathetic “we can’t change anything so just wait for the Lord” nonsense that GP preaches .
Here is a person who has not searched or studied the Scriptures for himself. He must copy and paste articles he finds on the net in an attempt to refute a position that I hold which he does not understand because of his betzpaenia and spiritual galactosemia.
This seed picker thinks that I am apathetic and believe that “we can’t change anything so just wait for the Lord” .
He is clearly not cognizant of the fact that WAITING FOR THE LORD IS THE CLEAR TEACHING OF THE NT
TWO HOLD BOOKS ARE DEVOTED TO THIS SUBJECT i.e 1 & 2 Thessalonians.
These books teach believers not only to WAIT but also to WATCH
TO WAKE UP AND TO
TO WAR read 1 Thess 5.
You see David when I teach the Word, the hearers tend to know the basics or at least they have RECEPTIVE HEARTS! On BU they are seeking to show that I can not rrightly divide the Word. They are hostile. They have stony hearts as described in the parables of the seed. In the Greek the word for “stony ground” is BED ROCK!
What do you want me to do BUT LAUGH LOL
Two whole books are devoted to the second coming
Several chapters such as 2 Peter 3 and the three chapters on the Olivet Discourse are given over to the concept of waiting.
Several major passdages such as Titus 2 11 et secq
11. For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12. Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
13. Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
14. Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
15. These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee.
Note that believers are to Look for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; VERSE 13
Note that it was JESUS not MLK who died for blacks VERSE 14 Any who say differently are WRONG…..according to what the Bible teaches.
Note Anonymous verse 14 says that believers must WORK! See also Titus 3:14 Ephesians 2:10
Sorry Annony It is not easy to give a crash course on the Christian life by giving a web site. LOL
GP…
Man don’t mek me laugh.
I don’t come here trying to debunk Zoe or you but anyone who claims that America was founded or developed on the basis of the word of God has been on crack pipes too long!!
Show me the word of God in the treatment of slaves, the Indian (true native Americans).
Where is the word of God in segregation, racism and servitude of a people.
Show me the foundation and the basis of the word of God in the inhumane practices meted out to the same immigrants who fled persecution in their homeland and came to America.
It is not for me to debunk or mock as you accuse me of, just asking obvious questions.
Why is it that every time I have to say something that you or Zoe don’t like, it is
called mocking?
Don’t you mock BU also when you claim it is just a place for you to laugh at the illiterates, yet it is a forum for you to share your biblical and medical lessons…make up ya mind man.
Zoe is quick to label anyone who don’t agree with him a ‘leftist’…does that make you and him right wing fellows…just asking?
Btw…the exam is in October in NY, where it costs much less, thanks for the well wishes.
Techie
NO one denies the points you are making about the atrocities that were done, Sir.
But it can not be denied that founding fathers had strong beliefs in God. Nor can it be denied that no other country had a similar origin.
History will show that even men with the best intentions have erred. The greatest Bible characters had flaws e.g Noah Moses David Solomon etc
BTW
I have no political interests either here or at home.
I still think that Zoe’s defense of Beck is reasonable. I take Beck at his word and do not judge his motives. I think that Beck is a novice in Biblical issues, and probably confused about his role. Consequently he was unable to do the job he set out to do; and for which he is probably most unsuitable in many ways.
But I give him credit for trying.
I am interested in progress efficiency etc
@ GP….
You say that you divide the word correctly.
I am asking you this, since there is only ONE TRUTH, is it reasonable to say that anyone who have not arrived at the same conclusion as you or Zoe is therefore incorrect?
You and Zoe have already dismissed the Catholics, Anglicans, JWs, Mormons, SDA etc.
Do the Jewish that Zoe defends so earnestly also divide the word correctly?….just asking.
Quoted by my husband in a letter to the Nation that was never published(we all know why) :
“There is something inherently insulting about the proposition that we’d be incapable of choosing right from wrong if we didn’t fear that a capricious despot up in the sky would condemn us to hell. But the biggest flaw in this argument is its assumption that belief in God does make its adherents choose good behaviour over bad. If that were
the case, this world —which is full of believers —- would be a far better place. In God’s name humans have slaughtered infidels, enslaved millions from other tribes, burned witches, persecuted those who were”different” and mutilated the genitalia of defenseless children. (Hardly an exhaustive list —–feel free to add your own atrocities).”
If that’s the morality we’d be lacking in a Bible-less and Godless world, I am all for it.
GP
do you walk on water too?! Do not begrudge Dr King the respect and gratitude of millions of people who recognise his contribution. Doesn’t it strike you as unbalanced to vent on the work of a dead man?
No annonymous I prefer to swim LOL
You can worship MLK like millions others.
I have never done so, and I dont plan to start
Is it not true that millions vent on the FINISHED SALVIFIC WORK OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST WHO DIED FOR THIER SINS? MLK died to save no one. To me his death is nothing. Not much different to you considering me a pompous buffoon and a non entity. LOL
I plan to worship JESUS ONLY! OK
In an interview on Fox/Faux News Bck admitted he is retracting his statement about Obama aving a deep seated hate for white people:
Wallace: “Do you regret having called [Obama] a racist and saying he had a deep seated hatred for white people?”
Beck: “Of course I do. I don’t want to retract the, um … I want to amend that I think it is much more of a theological question, that he is a guy who understands the world through liberation theology, which is oppressor-and-victim. ‘Racist,’ first of all, it shouldn’t have been said. It was poorly said. I have a big fat mouth sometimes and I say things. That’s just not the way people should behave. And it was not accurate. It is liberation theology that has shaped his world view.”
Soon and very soon all the TRUE BELIEVERS WILL DEPART FROM THIS WORLD. All the sinning believers will just vanish….. and it will be a God less believer less world.
But according to 2 Thessalonians 2 it wont be lots of fun. If you reject the TRUTH YOU BELIVE THE LIE
IF YOU REJECT CHRIST YOU WILL BE DEALING WITH ANTICHRIST!
I will like to hear the moronic mouthings then. Problem it wont be funny.
Techie
It should be obvious from a superficial reading of the Gospels that non belieing Jews wrongly divide the word of truth. Paul had lots of trouble with them in his journeys as described in Acts. Hope this helps.
Im amazed that you would think that Zoe does not know this fact LOL.
Mr David Sir
Did you see today’s Advocate.
Isnt it amazing that all of a sudden all these men who have been working in A & E for donkey years are now seeing that A& E ought to be extended to the polyclinics.
Isnt that an idea circulated on BU since January 2008?
Isnt that an idea presented to Government since January 2008? Ah lie?
Techie
It should be obvious from a superficial reading of the Gospels that non belieing Jews wrongly divide the word of truth. Paul had lots of trouble with them in his journeys as described in Acts. Hope this helps.
Im amazed that you would think that Zoe does not know this fact LOL.
By Georgie Porgie on August 30, 2010 at 12:43 PM
Lol GP…you should be a politician or laywer…that is not what I meant and you knew full well but hey, I have come across this type of answer before lol.
@GP
Read it with a smile.
GP opined….’May I ask you Sir, Oh fount of knowledge . ML King sacrificed his life to see the advancement and enfranchisement of his people (and by extension, the harmonious relatlionshiips of all), and the result to day is exactly what ???????
Jesus did the same and the result is what?????
Techie
A man cant win a round with you eh?
You debunk the people’s accepted History
Now you want to turn me into a lawyer or politician . You not easy man LOL
Me thinks its you that should be the lawyer politician, and do the Techie stuff as a hobby! Murdah.
Anonymous
As a result of Jesus intervention many ae to day preparing for the rapture, after which the fellas and gals who belive will be singing IN TUNE around the glassy sea with the four and twenty elders or with those praising the Lamb that was slain ( Revelation 4 & 5) LOL
Glen Beck is a reptilian shape shifter working for the Illuminati bloodline families,i’m not sure if he is family to anyone in particular but he is being used to further their agenda,watch these videos to learn more of your destiny or as some say our ” DOOM”
Not to burst your bubble guys but nearly all leaders of the world and certain members of their government that have direct ties to the Illuminati are reptilian shape shifters put there by the bloodline families,snakes especially,i don’t know if we have any here in Barbados but we will see in time.
Another example: -Most of them are reporters for news outlets like Fox news and CNN,here is a classic Brian Todd video,look at his eyes,tongue and lips.
No one can be right all the time
(Talking about GP not Obama)
Q.Where would America be if it wasn’t for slavery. Where would Britain and Europe be if it wasn’t for Colonialism.
A. Starving and living in poverty.
Folks, White America is angry, outraged at this black face, in that “White House.” It is as if whites woke up from a drunkened stupor, and are holding their heads, and saying “What have we done, we’ve elected a blackman.” Most of you, who have so admirably contributed to this blog, may have overlooked, how white Americans really think. Glen Beck a native son of the Pacific Northwest (Washington State)never has had any interaction with blacks, or people of color period. The fact that these “Tea Party” types are espousing these views, is just a reach back in time, predicated on the learned behavior coming from their ancestral lines. Although Dr King’s dream was good in its time, no longer can we the majority dark complexioned occupants of this planet, believe in pricipal and only in words, without actions. We must rise up, and crush any attempt by anyone, who will hearken to the sub-plot of returning America to an age of racial despotism. At he apex of this “Tea Party” foolishness, one will find a tremendous number of disheartened, disgruntle”Whit men.” Ask yourselves, why are white men, the ruling class in America, disgruntled? I’ll tell you why! They’re disgruntled because, global power is out of their reach. The rest of the world if it has not caught up to the United States of America, will be cathing up to the good old USA. No longer can the USA dominate, as the mouth piece of the world. White American men, were use to priviledge lives of flaunting their Americanesall over the world, and regardless of their indifference to other races, they were permitted to escape with the commission of horrific acts. In today’s geo political climate, Americans are being held accountable. Glenn Beck, the idiot savant Sarah Palin, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and others, are attempting to return America to a bygone age of political racial upheaval. The “Tea Partyers” are not making a political statement, their making a “Racial Statement.” The Licoln Memorial, was just the beginning, of what will lead America, down the road to future racial tensions, pehaps even race riots. In sum, that’s exactly what white disgruntled men would enjoy witnessing and participating in, especially during the Presidency of Barack Obama.
The good old days when police insulted blacks in the company of children and families.
Beck’s lunacy has been ignored for too long. He and his supporters are dangerous.
I dont know why you guys are making so much about Beck’s rally. Beck’s rally is much too late! The horse has left the stable a while ago.
As I have told you guys over and over the USA is not mentioned in prophecy. It must decline, and it is declining! As the Kings of the East and the Kings of the North and West and South gain the ascendancy…..as written.
Beck’s rally can not turn back the clock, nor is/was it about black or white.
However, for a “lunatic” as one of you called him, he did well to get such a loud crowd there. Didnt he? LOL.
”It is time to say that glenn beck who has apparently recently found Christ”
Beck religion of choice is that of being a Mormon! Isn’t that the religion that GP and Zoe dissed on other threads !
The only thing Beck have found recently is a way to use the Bible that would earn him millions and generate higher bratings for his show.
It really angers me when I hear these Americans run off at the mouth about democracy. Hypocrits, and parasites they are. These mass marauders, who fantacise about democracy without allowing democratic ideals to others. The USA has always lied about race matters, and their intentions to allow blacks equal access to constitutional freedoms enjoyed by whites. To understand the USA, one only needs to read through the entire USA constitutional document, and its twenty seven amendments. The bill of rights (The first ten amendments to the constitution) alone, should have been enough to offer guaranteed protections to the black population of the USA. Yet, the racist founding fathers of the USA, needed a thirteenth and fourteenth, and still thirteent more amendments to the constitution, to form a more perfect union. America’s tap dance with constituional decency is but another attempt at a “Smoke and Mirrors” trickery session. We who are able to live within the confines of black skin, know all to well, that no one can “legislate morality.” Moral indecency allows for the Glenn Becks of the world to denegrate, without moral outrage, the greatness of Dr Martin Luther King’s legacy. Remember, my brothers and sisters, the greatest historian in West Indian History, Dr Eric Williams, outlined the treachery of Columbus’ assault on our ancestors, by offering historical proof that Columbus was “kneeling to God, and enslaving the natives.” White America, has always praised god in one white breath, yet passed the ammunition of hatred in yet another breath. To allow the tolerance of hatred and racial malfeasance in twenty first century America, after all that blacks have endured, for five hundred years speaks volumes of the state of racial affairs in America. Make no mistake about this or any other facts as they relate to white America, all they care about is the color of money, and not about a damn thing else. There is no black community anywhere in the USA. If there was, reasonably speaking, blacks would not rely on whites for almost everything conceivable. The word community, speaks to an environ that self helps, is self absorbed and cures its problems, without interference from without. An ability to plan for generations yet unborn, building space stations, instead of engaging in mental midgetry with “Play Stations,” facilitates for communal growth and comittment to our people (Black People). Do not for one minute believe, that I’m angry with white intent for survival, I’m not. You see, if whites who are only ten percent of the world’s population don’t protect the sanctity of their generations yet unborn, who will? In order to understand the seriousness, of our state of global economic black affairs, we must enlist black people who do not suffer from the “Illusion of Inclusion.” Gone are those ignorant manifestations of “Stepin Fetchit” and the other despicable displays of black laziness and self pity. This is a proclamation of black self consciouness, only seriously committed blacks need apply. I don’t blame any “Tea Party” individual in America, I blame myself, for my ineptitude and lack of foresight. I want to thank the “Tea Party,” from this day forward, I am invigorated with the hope of a renewal to god, self, family and race. No longer can I afford to stand helplessly on the sidelines of self destruction, and by design allow the destruction of my family and my race. I just want to plan for generations yet unborn.
Did you read this GP
http://www.nationnews.com/articles/view/sick-bay-solution/
A fellow blogger has asked to do a reblog of his post on Mr. Beck. Here is some background on blogger Blipsterfarian to be found HERE.
Read full blog HERE.
Kiki
You’re right, Slavery provided the vehicle of wealth to the world. But you must also know this, “Rulers of Kingdoms, and dynasties,” that Africa gave the modern day Calendar, the alphabet and a system of mathematics to this world. Enslavement and social decay, are those things most associated with our people, yet had it not been for African ingenuity, most of the modern amenities enjoyed today, would never have existed. That it why, every black person on this planet should endeavor to walk proud, carrying the legacy of greatness of our ancestral past. It is disgraceful, for us to destroy the legacy of our ancestors, by allowing the populations born into our race to become enslaved by prison confinement, and lack of education. I’m speaking to black men mostly here, we must rise above the level of self absorbed moral self destruction, to find ourselves, deserving of the good black women in this world. We can no longer afford to hangout with the shiftless black men in our neighborhoods, who do nothing all day, except breathe, and expect for government handouts. Again, we can’t afford to play with “Play Stations,” while white men are building “Space Stations.” We as black men have to step up to the mantle of responsibility in our homes, and lead by example. Thank you Kiki.
@Expatriate
It is as if whites woke up from a drunkened stupor, and are holding their heads, and saying “What have we done, we’ve elected a black man.”
I have been saying the same thing.
I came across an article at the Newsweek recently written by Julia Baird.
Entitled: Blacks Are Getting Happier
Whites are not. Ask your mother why.
Excerpt:
It’s been an ugly time in race relations lately. Radio host Laura Schlessinger used the N word 11 times in five minutes; Shirley Sherrod, a black woman who preached redemption, was accused of hating whites; and professional provocateur Glenn Beck described himself and his fans as the real “inheritors and protectors of the civil-rights movement.”
Here are some of Martin’s own words:
“In my senior year in theological seminary, I engaged in the exciting reading of various theological theories. Having been raised in a rather strict fundamentalist tradition, I was occasionally shocked when my intellectual journey carried me through new and sometimes complex doctrinal lands, but the ‘PILGRIMAGE’ was always stimulating, gave me a new appreciation for objective appraisal and critical analysis, and knocked me out of my dogmatic slumber.”
“Liberalism provided me with an intellectual satisfaction that I had never found in fundamentalism. I became so enamored of the insights of liberalism that I almost fell into the trap of accepting uncritically everything it encompassed. I was absolutely convinced of the natural goodness of man and the natural power of human reason.”
“A basic change in my thinking came when I started to question some of the theories that had been associated with so-called liberal theology. Of course, there are aspects of liberalism that I hope to cherish always: its devotion to the search for truth, its insistence on an open and analytical mind, and its refusal to abandon the best lights of reason. The contribution of liberalism to the philological-historical criticism of Biblical literature has been of immeasurable value and should be defended with religious and scientific passion.”
“But I began to question the liberal doctrine of man. The more I observed the tragedies of history and man’s shameful inclination to choose the low road, the more I came to see the depths and strengths of sin. My reading of the works of Reinhold Niebuhr made me aware of the complexity of human motives and the reality of sin on every level of man’s existence. Moreover, I came to recognize the complexity of man’s social involvement and the glaring reality of collective evil. I realized that liberalism had been all too sentimental concerning human nature and that it had leaned toward a false idealism.”
“Although most of my formal study has been in systematic theology and philosophy, I have become more and more interested in social ethics. During my early teens I was deeply concerned by the problem of racial injustice. I considered segregation both rationally inexplicable and morally unjustifiable. I could never accept my having to sit in the back of a bus or in the segregated section of a train. The first time that I was seated behind a curtain in a dining-car I felt as though the curtain had been dropped on my selfhood. I also learned that the inseparable twin of racial injustice is economic injustice. I saw how the system of segregation exploited both the Negro and the poor whites. These early experiences made me deeply conscious of the varieties of injustice in our society.”
“My personal trials have also taught me the value of unmerited suffering. As my sufferings mounted I soon realized that there were two ways in which I could respond to my situation – either to react with bitterness or seek to transform the suffering into a creative force. I decided to follow the latter course. Recognizing the necessity for suffering, I have tried to make of it a virtue. If only to save myself from bitterness I have attempted to see my personal ordeals as an opportunity to transfigure myself and heal the people involved in the tragic situation which now obtains. I have lived these last few years with the conviction that unearned suffering is redemptive. There are some who still find the CROSS* a stumbling-block, others consider it foolishness, but I am more convinced than ever before that it is the power of God unto social and individual salvation. So like the Apostle Paul I can now humbly, yet proudly say, ‘I bear in my body the marks of the Lord Jesus’.”
“In the midst of outer dangers, I have felt an inner calm. In the midst of lonely days and dreary nights I have heard an inner voice saying – ‘Lo, I will be with you.’ When the chains of fear and the manacles of frustration have all but stymied my efforts, I have felt the power of God transforming the fatigue of despair into the buoyancy of hope. I am convinced that the Universe is under the control of a loving purpose, and that in the struggle for righteousness man has cosmic companionship. Behind the harsh appearances of the world there is a benign power… In spite of the tensions and uncertainties of this period something profoundly meaningful is taking place. Old systems of exploitation and oppression are passing away; new systems of justice and equality are being born. In a real sense this is a great time to be alive. Therefore I am not yet discouraged about the future. Granted that we face a world crisis which leaves us standing so often amidst the surging murmur of life’s restless sea. But every crisis has both its dangers and its opportunities. It can spell either salvation or doom. In a dark, confused world the Kingdom of God may yet reign in the hearts of men”
Here is the Shirley Sherrod NAACP speech. It is not a black and white thing. It is a green thing:
The blogger which ‘broke’ the Sherrod story edited her talk to make her look like a racist. I hope her suit hits where it hurts, in his pocket.
@Hants
Re Did you read this GP
http://www.nationnews.com/articles/view/sick-bay-solution/
Yes I did, Both the Advocate and the Nation carried stories where the guys are now parrotting the ideas that I presented to the DLP, and later on BU in January 2008.
Here we see men who have been A &E doctors for decades have suddenly come to the realization that the function of the polyclinics must be upgraded to take the weight off the QEH.
Causes you to wonder. LOL I have always been a visionary and usually way ahead of my peers in thinking. Same thing happens in the church and at the Medical Schools at which I have taught.
More from Martin:
“From all that I have attempted to say it should now be apparent that sincerity and conscientiousness in themselves are not enough. History has proven that these noble virtues may denigrate into tragic vices. Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.”
Shakespeare wrote:
‘For sweetest things turn sourest by their deeds;
Lilies that fester smell far worse than weeds.’
“As the chief moral guardian of the community, the church must implore men to be good and well-intentioned and must extol the virtues of kindheartedness and conscientiousness. But somewhere along the way the church must remind men that devoid of intelligence, goodness and conscientiousness will become brutal forces leading to shameful crucifixions. Never must the church tire of reminding men that they have a moral responsibility to be intelligent.”
“Must we not admit that the church has often overlooked this moral demand for enlightenment? At times it has talked as though ignorance was a virtue and intelligence was a crime. Through its obscurantism, close-mindedness, and obstinacy to new truth, the church has often unconsciously encouraged its worshipers to look askance upon intelligence.”
“But if we are to call ourselves Christians, we had better avoid intellectual and moral blindness. Throughout the New Testament we are reminded of the need for enlightenment. We are commanded to love God, not only with our hearts and souls, but also with our minds. When the Apostle Paul noticed the blindness of many of his opponents, he said, ‘I bear them record that they have a zeal for God but not according to knowledge.’ Over and again the Bible reminds us of the danger of zeal without knowledge and sincerity without intelligence.”
“So we have a mandate both to conquer sin and also to conquer ignorance. Modern man is presently having a rendezvous with chaos, not merely because of human badness, but also because of human stupidity. If Western civilization continues to denigrate until it, like twenty-four of its predecessors, falls hopelessly into a bottomless void, the cause will be not only its undeniable sinfulness, but also its appalling blindness. And if American democracy gradually disintegrates, it will be due as much to a lack of insight as to a lack of commitment to right. If modern man continues to flirt unhesitatingly with war and eventually transforms his earthly habitat into an inferno such as even the mind of Dante could not imagine, it will have resulted from downright badness and also from downright stupidity.”
The Shirley Sherrod story was powerful.
Here’s Martin on “Loving Your Enemies”
“Modern psychology recognizes what Jesus taught centuries ago: hate divides the personality and love in an amazing and inexorable way unites it.”
“A third reason why we should love our enemies is that love is the only force capable of transforming an enemy into a friend. We never get rid of an enemy by meeting hate with hate; we get rid of an enemy by getting rid of enmity. By its very nature, hate destroys and tears down; by its very nature, love creates and builds up. Love transforms with redemptive power.”
“Lincoln tried love and left for all history a magnificent drama of reconciliation. When he was campaigning for the presidency, one of his arch-enemies was a man named Stanton. For some reason Stanton hated Lincoln. He used every ounce of his energy to degrade him in the eyes of the public. So deep-rooted was Stanton hate for Lincoln that he uttered unkind words about his physical appearance, and sought to embarrass him at every point with the bitterest diatribes. But in spite of this Lincoln was elected President of the United States. Then came the period when he had to select his cabinet which would consist of persons who would be his most intimate associates in implementing his programme. He started choosing men here and there for the various secretaryships. The day finally came for Lincoln to select a man to fill the all-important post of Secretary of War. Can you imagine whom Lincoln chose to fill this post? None other than the man named Stanton. There was an immediate uproar in the inner circle when the news began to spread. Adviser after adviser was heard saying, ‘Mr. President, you are making a mistake. Do you know this man Stanton? Are you familiar with all the ugly things he said about you? He is your enemy. He will seek to sabotage your programme. Have you thought this through?’ Mr. Lincoln’s answer was terse and to the point: ‘Yes I know Mr. Stanton. I am aware of all the terrible things he has said about me. But after looking over the nation, I find he is the best man for the job.’ So Stanton became Abraham Lincoln’s Secretary of War and rendered an invaluable service to his nation and to his President. Not many years later Lincoln was assassinated. Many laudable things were said about him. Even today, millions of people still adore him as the greatest of all Americans. H. G. Wells selected him as one of six great men of history. But of all the great statements made about Abraham Lincoln, the words of Stanton remain among the greatest. Standing near the dead body of the man he once hated, Stanton referred to him as one of the greatest men that ever lived and said ‘he now belongs to the ages’. If Lincoln had hated Stanton both men would have gone to their graves as bitter enemies. But through the power of love Lincoln transformed an enemy into a friend. It was this same attitude that made that it possible for Lincoln to speak a kind word about the South during the Civil War when feeling was most bitter. Asked by a shocked bystander how he could do this, Lincoln said, ‘Madam, do I not destroy my enemies when I make them my friends?’ This is the power of redemptive love”
@David
“The Shirley Sherrod story was powerful”.
Amen. I thought I had to share it.
@GP,
Some of your interpretation of end-time-events are unscriptural and loaded with error. For example, this thing about Jesus coming and leaving people on the earth (Secret Rapture).
I
Sorry about that break.
In an earlier post you mentioned Scofield and his Bible.
Any respectable theologian or deep reader of things theological knows that that Bible is suspect and not used as seminary material. You could as well have quoted from the New World Translation.
Little Bobbie
Why dont you go and ask mummy to teach you how to read.
Ask her to help you to understand what book is being taught at Dallas Theological Seminary
Let her help you to try to understand the Word from Constables Notes.
http://www.soniclight.com/constable/notes.htm
Little Bobbie its folk like you that gives me so much mirth on BU. Fellas like you give me lots of pain in my sides.
Come again soon OK
More from Martin on “The Answer To A Perplexing Question”
“The second idea from removing evil from the world stipulates that if man waits submissively upon the Lord, in His own good time God alone will redeem the world. Rooted in a pessimistic doctrine of human nature, this idea, which eliminates completely the capability of sinful man to do anything, was prominent in the Reformation, that great spiritual movement which gave birth to the Protestant concern for moral and spiritual freedom and served as a necessary corrective for a corrupt and stagnant medieval church.”
“The doctrine of justification by faith and the priesthood of all believers are towering principles which we as Protestants must forever affirm, but the Reformation doctrine of human nature over-stressed the corruption of man. The Renaissance was too optimistic, and the Reformation too pessimistic. The former so concentrated on the goodness of man that it overlooked his capacity for evil; the latter so concentrated on the wickedness of man that it overlooked his capacity for goodness. While rightfully affirming the sinfulness of human nature and man’s incapacity to save himself, the Reformation wrongly affirmed that the image of God had been completely erased from man.”
“This led to the Calvanistic concept of total depravity of man and to a resurrection of the terrible idea of infant damnation. So depraved is human nature, said the doctrinaire Calvinist, that if a baby dies without baptism he will burn forever in hell. Certainly this carries the idea of man’s sinfulness too far.”
“This lopsided Reformation theology has often emphasized a purely other-worldly religion, which stresses the utter hopelessness of this world and calls upon the individual to concentrate on preparing his soul for the world to come. By ignoring the need for social reform, religion is divorced from the mainstream of human life. A pulpit committee listed as the first essential qualification for a new minister: ‘He must preach the true gospel and not talk about social issues.’ This is a blueprint for a dangerously irrelevant church where people assemble to hear pious platitudes.”
“By disregarding the fact that the gospel deals with man’s body as well as his soul, such a one-sided emphasis creates a tragic dichotomy between the sacred and the secular. To be worthy of its New Testament origin, the church must seek to transform both individual lives and the social situation that brings to many people anguish of spirit and cruel bondage.”
“The idea that man expects God to do everything leads inevitably to a callous misuse of prayer. For if God does everything, man then ask Him for anything, and God becomes little more than a ‘cosmic bellhop’ who is summoned for every trivial need. Or God is considered so omnipotent and man so powerless that prayer is a substitute for work and intelligence.”
“A man said to me, ‘I believe in integration, but I know it will not come until God wants it to come. You Negroes should stop protesting and start praying.’ I am certain we need to pray for God’s help and guidance in this integration struggle, but we are gravely misled if we think the struggle will be won only by prayer. God, who gave us minds for thinking and bodies for working, would defeat His own purpose if He permitted us to obtain through prayer what may come through work and intelligence. Prayer is a marvelous and necessary supplement of our feeble efforts, but it is a dangerous substitute. When Moses strove to lead the Israelites to the Promised Land, God made it clear that He would not do for them what they could do for themselves. ‘And the Lord said unto Moses, wherefore criest thou unto me? Speak unto the children of Israel that they go forward’.”
Posted by TB @ 2010/08/31 at 6:40 AM
A quote from MLK
Posted by David @ August 29, 2010 at 10:09 PM
A quote from David (BU)
@ DAVID
“MLK unlike many theologians of today went out amongst the people to seek to be an agent for change to promote what he believed was right and just. He did so at great sacrifice to his family, friends and himself paying with his life. Many of our modern theologians prefer to jet around in private jets, extorting fees to deliver flowery speeches and to preach from pulpits adorn with crystal and and other adornments.”
I could NOT* say it any better!!!
Hence the “LONG PILGRIMAGE” – coupled with “BANKRUPT MORAL LEADERSHIP”…
I know this does not sit well with a lot of folks David but the reality is frankly pathetic – no wonder modern-day Christianity is so spiritually impotent and inept, “a dog outside the gates with a lotta’ bark, rubber-teeth and no bite”…
Can you understand why so many are turned off, to go in search of other religious experiences?
Now that is a powerful and profound statement above David.
Problem is that most of these Christians are quite comfortable being caught up in their worldly possessions.
Basic brotherly love and genuine care for each other is merely a myth as they sit down and do nothing to help their brothers while waiting on the rapture. All the while, passing off everyday occurrences as prophecy being fulfilled.
If anyone wants to understand where the rants of GP and Zoe come from (i.e. unabashed and uncritical support for Israel and Zionism, an ultra- pessimistic outlook on the future of human society and the absolute rejection of every other religious view including mainline protestantism) just read the following link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dispensationalism
The American Church in Crisis: Groundbreaking Research Based on a National Database of over 200,000 Churches
Amazon.com: The Fall of the Evangelical Nation: The Surprising Crisis Inside the Church (9780061117169): Christine Wicker: Books
It is clear that with the ascendancy of Dispensationalism and its geo-political offspring, Christian Zionism in American political life and foreign policy, much of the post world war 2 insecurity, terrorism, violence and instability in the world has occurred. The irony of the situation is that while most ordinary dispensationlists generally eschew personal political and governmental involvement, leaders of the movement have taken control of the US political administration and are pursuing an agenda which involves trying to engineer the end times of the world. The true “illuminati” of the conspiracy theorists may just be the local evangelical church down the road.
Here is Christine’s research:
Christine Wicker (a former Evangelical) reports that Evangelical Christianity in America – supposedly Christianity’s cutting edge – is dying. She says the idea that evangelicals are taking over America is one of the greatest publicity scams in history, a perfect coup accomplished by savvy politicos and religious leaders, who understand how the media work and exploit them brilliantly.
(Hence the lameness of the TEA PARTY MOVEMENT)…
The facts are that about a thousand evangelicals walk away from their churches every day and most don’t come back. As a whole, American Christians lose six thousand members a day – more than two million a year, while the U.S. population increases by 1.2% – currently 3.3 million people a year.
The real figures are that fewer than seven percent of the country are really evangelicals – only about one in fourteen, not one out of four as they have claimed. Southern Baptist growth isn’t keeping up with population growth, and it hasn’t for years. Baptisms are going down in every age group except children under five.
And in the critical group of young adults ages eighteen to thirty-four, Southern Baptist baptisms fell 40% from 100,000 in 1980 to 60,000 in 2005. During these 25 years, the U.S. population grew from about 226,545,805 to 296,000,000, a growth of over 30%. The Baptists would have had to baptize over 130,000 in 2005 just to stay even with population growth; they baptized fewer than half that number.
The fastest growing faith groups in the country are atheists and nonbelievers. In just the eleven years from 1990 to 2001, they more than doubled, from 14 million to 29 million, from 8% of the country to 14%.
There are more than twice as many nonbelievers and atheists as there are evangelicals. Since it’s hard to believe everyone would have the nerve to tell a pollster they were an atheist or nonbeliever, the real figures are almost certainly higher. You don’t read this in the media because there are no savvy or powerful groups pushing the story.
When asked to rate eleven groups in terms of respect, non-Christians rated evangelicals tenth. Only prostitutes ranked lower. In an almost comic side note, Wicker wonders how the prostitutes feel about that.
Atheists and nonbelievers are looking pretty good.
Misbehavior is so widespread among evangelicals that one evangelical author (Ronald Sider) calls the statistics devastating.
When pollster George Barna, himself an evangelical, looked at seventy moral behaviors, he didn’t find any difference between the actions of those who were born-again Christians and those who weren’t.
His studies and other indicators show that divorce among born-again Christians is as common as, or more common than, among other groups.
One study showed that wives in traditional, male-dominated marriages were 300% more likely to be beaten than wives in egalitarian marriages.
Evangelicals make up only 7% of the population, but about 20% of the women who get abortions. (Most Catholics in America use contraception, and also have abortions at about the same rate as others.)
Every day the percentage of evangelicals in America decreases, a loss that began more than a century ago. While the U.S. population grows at a rate of about 1.3% a year, Southern Baptist growth was down to 0.02% in 2005 and still falling. This is part of the bigger picture of the continual decline of Christianity in our culture, which is another story that’s been under-reported.
What’s to blame for all this? It’s a long list of both the usual suspects and some unusual ones, as we’ll see. But basically, evangelicals tried to fight the modern world and the world won.
(WHAT CHRISTINE DID NOT ADD* WAS THE LACK OF SOUND MORAL LEADERSHIP* AND THE BANKRUPT NATURE OF CHRISTIANITY THAT IS MORE CONCERNED ABOUT SOWING & REAPING (The Gospel of Prosperity) THAN THEY CARE ABOUT THE TRUE WELFARE OF THEIR ADHERENTS…
Josh McDowell, who has worked for Campus Crusade for Christ since 1964, says that 94% of high school graduates leave the faith within two years. The Southern Baptists estimate that 88% of their kids leave the church after high school.
During the past century, evangelicals have never kept up with the population growth in this country. They don’t have anywhere near the real power they have claimed. They have fought to make abortion illegal for 35 years. It’s still legal. They have fought for a Constitutional Amendment to outlaw homosexuality. Nobody’s buying it. And though they have done harm to and through the Republican Party, they don’t have anything like control there either. Remember that the recent court decisions permitting homosexual marriages in Massachusetts, California and New York all came from Republican judges.
Politically organized evangelicals have censored some school textbooks, but one result is that American students now lag far behind students in Europe and Asia, especially in science education, which will make us less competitive. Eventually, even market forces will have to improve the quality of our public education, because we need independent thinking workers, not just obedient ones.
“The upshot of all this,” says Wicker, is that evangelicals number 15 million adults, a large enough group to make a difference but in percentage terms a tiny proportion of Americans, and they are not growing enough to make a difference. Nonreligious people, whose numbers are rising, outnumbered them two to one in 2001. We have been duped. It is no exaggeration to say that the fate of Protestant Christianity in America hangs on the success of the evangelicals. If they aren’t making it, neither is Western Christianity.
As Dr. Martin Luther King, so aptly said:
“Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere IGNORANCE and conscietious STUPIDITY.” emphasis added.
Again, as Dr. King so correctly stated:
“Over and over again the Bible reminds us of the danger of zeal without KNOWLEDGE (i.e., ignorance) and sincerity without intelligence.” emphasis added.
Approved and Disapproved Workers.
“Remind them of these things, charging them before the LORD not to strive about words to no profit, to the RUIN of the hearers. Be DILIGENT to present yourself APPROVED to God, a worker who does NOT need to be ashamed, RIGHTLY DIVIDING the Word of TRUTH.” (2 Timothy 2: 14, 15) emphasis added.
God’s Word: Read It! Study It! Memorize It!
THE WORD OF GOD. The Bible – God’s inspired Word – is the ONLY conclusive source of wisdom, knowledge, and understanding concering ultimate reality. It IS a fountainhead of freeing TRUTH ( John. 8:32) and a gold mine of practical principles (Ps. 19:10), waiting to LIBERATE and /or enrich the person who will pursue its TRUTH and wealth. Thus, Paul’s instruction to “be diligent…a worker” has been applied by serious Christians through the centries as a directive to study the Word of God. The ONLY way to healthy, balanced living is through the “RIGHTLY DIVIDING” (Greek ‘orthotomounta’ literally, ‘cutting straight”), of God’s Word. Such correct, straight-on application of God’s Word is the result of diligent study. The text calls us beyond casual approaches to the Scriptures, telling us to REFUSE to suit the Bible for our own convenience or ideology.
In his earlier words ( I Tim. 4:13) Paul also told Timothy, “Give attention to reading [God's Word],” but now he emphasizes studying like a “worker” (from Greek ‘ergon-” toil, effort”), Ps. 119:11 urges memorizing the Word of God as a mighty deterrent against sin. Memorizing the Scriptures also provides an immediate availability of God’s “words” as a sword, ready in witnessing and effective in spiritual warefare (Heb. 4:12; Eph. 6:17. (Is. 55:10, 11, 2 Tim 3:16). (Kingdom Dynamics, The Spirit-Filled Life Bible, p1854)
So, to that poster, who stupidly, ignorantly, and in obvious spiritual blindness, said:
“Any respectable theologian or deep reader of things theological knows that the Bible is suspect and not used as seminal material.”
You are in a lost world of utter FOLLY, as you know not what you say, as the same Word of God, the Bible that you decry with utter contempt, speak to those of you ilk:
“The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. But FOOLS despise wisdom and instruction.” (Prov. 1:7)
“We as black men have to step up to the mantle of responsibility in our homes, and lead by example. Thank you Kiki.”
The above was taken from a comment by Expatriate | August 30, 2010 at 7:15 PM.
I would add, not only in the homes, but in the wider community as well.
I believe that Dr. GP alluded to the same idea in an earlier post. It is also my belief that if those of African descent (blacks/negro?) could lift up their (collective) heads and walk with the regal dignity with which they are naturally endowed and show that they could rise above the “malaise” this would be of a far better advantage to them. However, as long as this petty jealousy and bickering amongst themselves is allowed to continue there will remain this feeling of being disadvantaged. The general thought is that development of this world was done on the backs of the black men and women for the benefit of the “whites”. My question is that if this is so, then why can’t development be done by the “blacks” for themselves rather than for “others”?
Come on guys, the world does not owe you, or no one in the world owes you, a favour.
Ah wonder where ROKie hiding out these days?
Why Alveda King Is Perfect For Glenn Beck’s Rally?
http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/why-alveda-king-perfect-glenn-becks-rally
In the last lengthy post by the raiser of the bar, one wonders what is the point he is trying to make.
Clearly all of that meandering goo is summarised by the rhetorical question asked by the LOrd Jesus in Luke 18:8
IT IS TO BE EXPECTED. AND IT IS OCCURING.
The first three chapters summarize predictively the progress of the church age. It seems to be very accurate, isnt it?
Any one who has studied, and understood the WORD and can properly apply it, can understand that this verse is a prophesy that is being fulfilled.
Are we surprised when folk mock those who speak of fulfilled prophesies? If you do not know the prophesy. if you do not understand the Word how can you understand when a prophesy is being fulfilled.
Does such a stupid soul really beleve that their mocking will prevent the fulfillment of any prophesy?
Now David do you see why I come here for my daily laughs. I come to see folk pontificating about things they do not know. Hilarious
Technician
I will debunk David’s nonsense again later,, but I want you to understand that the state of Christendom (which includes Christianity) is exactly where it was PREDICTED TO BE according to Jesus’ edict in Luke 18:8 and the clear teaching of Revelation 3- which neither you or David has read or understood!
Christians like NON CHRISTIANS are quite comfortable being caught up in their worldly possessions. Are you not like them? Hence you are straining your brain to pass an exam so that you can have more possessions.
You can not generalize and say that “ Basic brotherly love and genuine care for each other is merely a myth” as this is NOT TRUE. Many Church Groups and Para Church organizations (along with some charlatans) are actively serving NON BELIEVERS IN ALL PARTS OF THE WORLD. I have seen in NYC a church group led by a Trinidadian house poor, give them jobs and feed them. I have seen a well run camp run by a Bajan in VA that feeds children all summer and bus them to several educational locations. Much of this work is done in the US and in other parts of the world
In the underground church in Africa and Asia believers are sharing their good with others just as the early church did
YOU ARE PROPAGETING A NASTY STINKING LIE BORN IN THE PITS OF HELL ITSELF BY SATAN TECHIE .
True believers, are not sitting down . MANY ARE WORKING MANY ARE AWAKE MANY ARE WARRING AGAINTS THE WICKEDNESS IN HIGH PLACES IN THIS WORLD
And just in case you didn’t know Sir. Jesus command to believers is to WATCH & WAIT FOR HIS RETURN AT THE RAPTURE. Read Mathhew 25 especially
Techie if you knew the prophecies you will note that there is nothing everyday about what you call “everday occurrences.” People who believe in the prophecies about the second coming do so BECAUSE THE PROPHECIES OF THE FIRST COMING WERE ACCURATELY FULFILLED.
The fulfillment of Daniel’s prophecies concerning Medio Persia, the Greeks and the Romans can not be refuted.
A bit off topic but pertinent to all of us anyway.
Listen up folk to what the PM (btw, not project manager!) of T&T had to say as quoted by Newsday newspaper;
““It is not enough to proudly proclaim our independence when we are lagging behind the rest of the developed world in so many areas,” Persad-Bissessar said. “When our people no longer cower in fear from criminals, (then) we are truly independent;
When the labour and intellect of a woman are considered equal to that of a man and the colour, class and creed of a citizen are of no consequence, we are all truly independent:-
When we grow to understand and respect our environment, we have gained our independence;
When we can aspire to be better people, when mediocrity is no longer tolerated and excellence is a standard by which everything is measured every day, then and only then we have truly gained our independence,” Persad-Bissessar told the nation.”"
Nuff respect to that lady PM!
Careful de hood, some will come here and denigrate the lady PM, say they do not worship her (as if you do) , state that she is evil personified because she is a Hindu and proclaim that it is a waste of time to work for such a state of affairs (no crime, mutual respect, environmental care etc) as the world is coming to end soon anyway and Jesus will put it alright. They may then quote and reference many Bible passages that have no relevance to anything you wrote and metaphorically pat themselves on the back for being so righteous and best of all to NOT be like you and with smug conviction revel in your assured condemnation by God because you are not like them.
1. David
2. I know that you love to be provocative
3. Re “The second idea from removing evil from the world stipulates that if man waits submissively upon the Lord, in His own good time God alone will redeem the world.
4.
5. Could you tell us how and when in history has man been able to redeem himself or the world . One word that is used to translate the word “redeem” is anti luetron. It has the sense of being anti or against being tied up.
6.
7. Can you or the idiot you quoted tell us how man will untie himself from his wicked evil self, or from sin? Its one thing to string some words together that sounds good. I am only asling
8. Re
9. Rooted in a pessimistic doctrine of human nature, this idea, which eliminates completely the capability of sinful man to do anything, was prominent in the Reformation, that great spiritual movement which gave birth to the Protestant concern for moral and spiritual freedom and served as a necessary corrective for a corrupt and stagnant medieval church.
Is human nature generally good or bad? If good why do we have police? Why is corruption rampant.
Was Jesus wrong in his observations in Mark 7 ;13‘ After pointing out that the Jews of his day were “Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye. “ He continued thus
14 And when he had called all the people [unto him], he said unto them, Hearken unto me every one [of you], and understand:
15 There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.
16 If any man have ears to hear, let him hear.
Later in the same chapter verse 18 He said this to his disciples
Are ye so without understanding also? Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, [it] cannot defile him;
19 Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats?
20 And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man.
21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,
22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:
23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.
Tell me David. Should we follow the words of Jesus, or of that of a moron who likes to throw words together without understanding that what he is saying is clearly contradictory to the teaching of the Word of God?
Are the things described in verses 21-22 rampant in the contemporary cosmos diabolicus, or not. Did you notice that Jesus said they come from within.
Now if you will read Romans 7, you will find that Paul had great difficulty fighting the sin in his life.
Why do you think that the early Anglicans wrote the oft repeated prayer in which a section goes like this WE HAVE DONE THOSE THINGS WHICH WE OUGHT NOT TO HAVE DONE AND WE HAVE NOT DONE THOSE THINGS WHICH OUGHT NOT TO HAVE DONE. You think these men were crazy? Or were they like Paul and all men unable to redeem themselves?
Apart from your smug sarcasm, you have very little to add of substance to the debate. And you can scoff as much as you like, the world is coming to end soon anyway the and Jesus WILL INDEED put it alright.
Whereas men have worked from time immemorial to achieve a state where there is no crime, mutual respect, environmental care etc and whereas, we will continue to do so, it ought to be obvious to you that we are not achieving Utopia! In fact there is more crime and violence and a lack of care for the environment, and a hatred for God and his Word and His SON- the one who ACTUALLY DIED FOR BLACKS ON THE CROSS- thabn ever before. And that you cant deny.
Fellas like you Annonymous and others have to follow the mainstream. This blog is another one of those BLACK VS WHITE threads. I am trying to take the nonsense to a higher and spiritual plain.
Now King was supposed to be a famous Theologian. I am a nobody, and to most on BU and idiot, but thank God I can think!
I must thank the bar raiser for these snippets from the mouth of the exalted KING
KING: I was absolutely convinced of the natural goodness of man and the natural power of human reason.”
INTERESTING! Simple folk like me call this FALSE TEACHING REGARDLESS TO WHO SAYS IT!
ISNT THIS A CONTRADICTION OF THE BIBLE TRUTH THAT THE HEART IS DECIETFUL & DESPERATELY WICKED ? Regardlees to who says it, sane sober sensible souls should be able to see that !
The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked; who can know it? Jertemiah 17:9
Should not a man who went to three schools and Theological Seminary not be able to get the tenet of Basic scriptures learned as teens in Sunday school correct?
Jesus would have responded to the celebrated King thus: Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered
Cf Mark 7:13
KING My reading of the works of Reinhold Niebuhr made me aware of the complexity of human motives and the reality of sin on every level of man’s existence. Moreover, I came to recognize the complexity of man’s social involvement and the glaring reality of collective evil. I realized that liberalism had been all too sentimental concerning human nature and that it had leaned toward a false idealism.”
Man you don’t have to read the works of Reinhold Niebuhr to be aware of the complexity of human motives and the reality of sin on every level of man’s existence.” You only have to look through your window and observe village life. You only have to watch the news on tv or read the newspaper. Or you can read what Jesus said about this in Mark chapter 7!
21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,
22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:
23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.
Now these sins are committed today with great complexity and intrigue. Just listen to the news or read the daily paper.
OK I know you guys prefer King’s and Niebuhr”s opinion …. But this is what Jesus said OK I know that you don’t take Jesus too seriously. But I do OK?
KING There are some who still find the CROSS* a stumbling-block, others consider it foolishness, but I am more convinced than ever before that it is the power of God unto social and individual salvation.
THE BIBLE DOES NOT TEACH THAT THE CROSS IS THE POWER OF GOD UNTO SOCIAL AND INDIVIDUAL SALVATION
In my experience I have observed that the Cross has the capacity to save men from thier sins as individuals, and that as a consequence of thier removing themselves from thier sinful past their social lives change.
Maybe Zoe can exegete the verse in Romans 1 that teaches about this.
KING So like the Apostle Paul I can now humbly, yet proudly say, ‘I bear in my body the marks of the Lord Jesus’.”
Actually King was here suffering from delusions of grandeur. Paul suffered for TEACHING THE WORD OF GOD. The word of God changes men!
KING I am convinced that the Universe is under the control of a loving purpose, and that in the struggle for righteousness man has cosmic companionship. Behind the harsh appearances of the world there is a benign power…
What exactly does this mean? WHY DOES HE NOT SAY THAT GOD RULES IN THE AFFAIRS OF MEN.
KING Old systems of exploitation and oppression are passing away; new systems of justice and equality are being born. In a real sense this is a great time to be alive. Therefore I am not yet discouraged about the future. Granted that we face a world crisis which leaves us standing so often amidst the surging murmur of life’s restless sea. But every crisis has both its dangers and its opportunities. It can spell either salvation or doom. In a dark, confused world the Kingdom of God may yet reign in the hearts of men”
No King IT IS THE COSMOS DIABOLICUS THAT IS PASSING AWAY and marching up and down like the Grand Old Duke of York wont do it and has not done it. See 1 John 1:15-17
And the Kingdom of God WILL NOT reign in the hearts of men until the Prince of Peace returns in the Millennium and ushers in His Kingdom.
Maybe if he had stuck to the simple Theology he learned in the Baptist Church he might have done better.
Do you think King suffered more for the TRUE FAITH than the Petrobrushians, Waldenses, Lollards or other Baptists who are described in the trail of Blood.
Now you can scoff at me because I dare to disagree with the exalted King. But think for a moment. Was King perfect? Was his emmissions all acurate? Was his Theology poor? Must we acclaiom others because others do? Or do we have the right to think and have another view?
I am sure that few of you have heard or even care about George Mueller of Bristol, but was ot his work BASED ENTIRELY ON PRAYER more practical?
But Mueller was not black and he did not ALLEGEDLY die for blacks. Hilarious.
The world is better place today than it was yesterday. It may suit your moronic pessimism to deny this but the objective reality is that there has been overall continual progress. Contrary to Backett’s post, I thought more people (especially in Africa and Asia) were joining Christian churches than ever before. What irritates me about your unbalanced position is that you denigrate those who faced with the choice of doing good or doing nothing or worse evil, chose good. Individually, none of us control the future. Each of us every day face choices between good and evil. Most of us try with our limited intelligence, weak spirits and bodies do the best we can. Some achieve great things, some (most) achieve only small victories but we press on. Maybe our efforts will all come to nought but what else to do, give up? My dear Mother-in-Law use to encourage me with this saying “work as if you have no faith, have faith as if you did no work.” Often after reading your and Zoe’s words, I feel that the Jesus you worship instead of bringing new Life is one bringing death.
@ Anonymous | August 31, 2010 at 2:53 PM |
You wrote:- “The world is better place today than it was yesterday.”
……………………………………………………………………………………………………..
Sir, I humbly suggest you go take a look at the latest newscast and come back and tell me if the above statement is really a true one.
Maybe you have not been reading your scriptures of late, if you were I don’t think that you would have made such a comment. Sir, I would also like to suggest that you pay a little bit more attention to what Dr. GP is trying to tell us here. He may not it have all strictly correct (he and I see a few things differently) but generally speaking he has a good take on what the Holy Scriptures teach us.
The world IS a better place today than it was yesterday. The study of history confirms this not the latest newscast. GP has A take on what the Bible teaches not THE take. Even you acknowledges this. Note you wrote “He may not it have all strictly correct (he and I see a few things differently)”. Tell me which things should I ignore and which should I accept? That aside, what do you understand GP is trying to tell us here? Please be explicit and clear.
@| August 31, 2010 at 4:30 PM |
do have the faculty of hearing because we have ears, but do we really LISTEN and FOLLOW the counsel of those who are CRYING IN THE WILDERNESS?
Sir, with all due respect I think Dr. GP is doing a pretty good job of explaining what he is trying to tell us. I don’t think he is writing in a language that is foreign to either of us. I do believe the world needs to listen a bit more carefully to the message of the Gospel. We (or most of us, anyway
Thank you for your response.
Get over it. Awful things happen ed. Individuals get up and make a stand and then less awful things happen. But awful things keep on happening and it’s not about the colour of your skin, either. The British Empire lasted for about 300 years. We have had the US Empire for about 50 or so years now. Soon about to be subsumed by either China or India. We have this whole Muslim thing going on, full of persecution of minorities. Empires and their sub-sets come and go. The point is that we have choices. How did all those Germans accept the Nazis? Now that we are in such a global age, all of us who believe in democracy have to resist being dragged into the joyfull acceptance of some kind of a system where one ideology rules all. Yes, I accept that “Democracy” could be called an ideology but so far, it’s the best we have. We just don’t need individuals quoting from their bibles, korans etc. we just need a situation where all of us can just go to the ballot box without being terrorised about what we really think. It’s not rocket science.
Our daily lives are involved. Say the society we live in suddenly got pear-shaped and decided that girls shouldn’t be allowed to go to school or homosexuals should be killed, or that all Jews should be sent to the gas chamber. What would you do? What would you do if it was suddenly agreed that black people did not have souls? That and all of the above were agreed by legitimate governments in the C20th. That’s why we need Democracy today.
Annonymous
The world is better place today than it was yesterday.
Oh yeah!? You don’t watch the news on international tv stations do you?
Are you willing to contradict Jesus’ teachings on this issue in Mark 7?
I am not a pessimist at all. I am very optimistic, and I am one to encourage folk to do greater things than they think they can. And I have achieved that in teaching students leading choirs etc
But I am a serious believer in what the Word of God says. And there is a lot of optimism there isn’t there? That is for those who believe God! Its not very good for those who reject God’s Word. But the good thing is that EVERONE HAS A CHOICE AND THE RIGHT TO GO GOD’s WAY.
If as you say there has been overall continual progress, then we would be approaching perfection. There would be LESS murders and rapes and thefts and drug abuse inter alia Woudn’t they? Ah lie? Thats not what I will see on tv news tonight for Central Florida alone
Although (especially in Africa and Asia) more folk are becoming born again and joining Christian churches than ever before, many still reject the Gospel message. Is that not so? Even here on BU we Bible belioevers have been mocked and scoffed at for over two years.
What irritates you about me is that you can not confound me with your ignorance. You are just NOT in my league! I have not denigrated a soul. I have questioned Theological positions that at variance with the Word of God.
Hurray! You get something right! …..at last!
Re Each of us every day face choices between good and evil. Most of us try with our limited intelligence, weak spirits and bodies do the best we can.
BUT this is the dilemma faced by all as described by Paul in Romans 7 and in the Anglican prayer that I cited in an earlier post. Ah lie?
Re Individually, none of us control the future. BUT GOD DOES. So maybe we should seek to follow his way, his edicts, his predictions…. his prophecies
With all due respect Sir, your mother in law is not a sage and her edict is bovine excrement! And a non sequitur! “work as if you have no faith, have faith as if you did no work.” And it contradicts what you were trying to say when you quoted from James chapter 2 two nights ago. Ah lie?
THE CLEAR TEACHING OF BOTH PAUL AND JAMES IS THAT WORK FOLLOWS FAITH! Paul spoke of the ROOT of faith in Romans. James talks about the FRUIT of faith in James 2. Now go back and see if you can help your mother in law to get it right!
re Some achieve great things, some (most) achieve only small victories but we press on. BECAUSE WE HAVE HOPE AND SOME FAITH? Ah lie?
Maybe our efforts will all come to nought but what else to do, give up? NO we don’t! If we are out of work we send applications every day. If we are ill we seek medical help. If we are dumb we seek enlighten ment.
If you are trying to help morons to understand Basic things ON BU YES! YOU GIVE UP! BECAUSE FOLK LIKE YOU ARE INEDUCABLE! LOL
Re Often after reading your and Zoe’s words, I feel that the Jesus you worship instead of bringing new Life is one bringing death.
It is not our fault that you do not understand. Because we are very clear and very accurate. And there are indeed two sides to Jesus as can be seen from a study of Genesis 13 There is the light or torch, and there is the fire of his wrath
JESUS DID BRING LIFE TO THOSE WHO RECEIVE THE LIGHT HE BROUGHT. In 1 Tim 4 10 we see that salvation is SUFFICIENT but it is only EFFICIENT to those who BELIEVE
Medication only helps IF YOU RECEIVE IT INTO YOUR BODY
THE GIFT OF SALVATION IS ONLY GOOD TO THOSE WHO RECEIVE IT.
Lets see if you can pick it up in John 3
16. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Verse 18 indicates that there is CHOICE!
There are those who BELIEVE! THESE ARE SAVED!
There are those WHO CHOOSE NOT TO BELIEVEE . These are condemned. Its simple. Even a moron like me understood that as a teen. LOL
This last part is interesting …………………………………………..
19. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
DON’T LISTEN TO ME OR ZOE! LISTEN TO THE WORD WE POINT YOU TO
Annonymous
Re The world IS a better place today than it was yesterday. The study of history confirms this not the latest newscast.
The latest newscast is of course now a part of history!
You will find that all the sins committed today and that will be shown in the news tonight will fall into these three basic categories
1 the lust of the flesh,
2 the lust of the eyes, and
3 the pride of life see i John 2:16
Our forefathers commited these sins in the Garden of Eden.
And since then ALL men have been guilty of these sins.
Know why Christ is my hero and my only hero?…. and not KIng or any other man BECAUSE HE ALONE DID NOT SUCCUMB WHEN TEMPTED IN ALL THREE OF THESE CATEGORIES OF SIN Read about it in Mathew 4 and Luke 4
Thanks GP.
In the underground church in Africa and Asia believers are sharing their good with others just as the early church did
YOU ARE PROPAGETING A NASTY STINKING LIE BORN IN THE PITS OF HELL ITSELF BY SATAN TECHIE .
Am I GP?? just follow the comments of you and Zoe on this blog in reference to helping others and tell me what about my comment is a lie. That is MY opinion of most so called Christians I have come across in life.
Christians like NON CHRISTIANS are quite comfortable being caught up in their worldly possessions. Are you not like them? Hence you are straining your brain to pass an exam so that you can have more possessions
But you see GP…I am not a Christian. You have sprained your brain also to be where you are today and you have boasted many times about your real estate, so I am or going to be in good company…lol.
I guess at the end of it all we are just mere men.
@GP
David of BU provocative? naw!
GP understand this and understand it well. The BU household has locked into a few guiding principles about how we want to live our lifes. David or any member of the BU household will never* argue theology with you because we are not competent so to do.
Here is what we will argue and defend to the death. Winning hearts and souls using a bombastic delivery does not reconcile with our understanding of right and wrong or common sense for that matter. If you understand this simple philosophy to which the BU household subscribe it would translate our position on many matters.
Hi Dr. GP,
Man, you in high gear! Take care yuh eh gine 2 fas fuh dese fellas.
David
Again you miss the point of my post when I spoke of being provocative. Perhaps you should look up the etymology of the word.
Again you fail to understand that historically and universally the preaching of the Word of God is not done as you think it ought to be done say what you like.
There are many ways of presenting the Word, refgardlees to what thelimited understanding of the BU household might be.
Paul said that he sought to persuade men by all means. Paul or Peter or Jesus for that mateer were not sweet bread preachers.
Read the Gospels. I wish I could have been there to see Jesus rip the Saducess and Pharises to pieces. I would love to have been there in John 8:44 when he told the Jews that they were like thier fathers the devil. Was that bombastic.
I started off here on BU explaining this and explaining the other. The response was mocking and scoffing and derision and sarcasm The only ones who would ask a question are you and Technician.
In contrast you had folk spiiting error from the darj deep abyss. Many belieers might differ in interpretation on some points. Some come from denominations and dont understand their denominational dogma. All churches have dogma that is at variance to the Word. I am always teaching against dogma in my church group.
But trust me David I have never in my personal witnessing on the streets of Barbados heard the way out recalitrant rubbish I have encoutered on BU in the last two years
Technician
You can not in fairness extrapolate your experiences of the Christians you have come across in your life with the reality that is! Clearly you are more logical than that. You made a blanket statement which just is not true, based only on your experience. You surely know more maths and basic statistics to understand that that is wrong Techie.
That is one of the problems I face on BU. At HC or UWI or in the for a where I have operated, no one would let you get away with such a statistical erroneous statement. On BU most people are trying to win an arguement at all cost, rather than in FACTS and TRUTH AT ALL COST. It gets annoying.
The early church followed the tenets of Acts 2:42 and many local churches still do.
You do not know of the individual contributions of either Zoe or I. I am not going to boast of what I have done for any believers on BU, but I can tell you of the gifts and treatment and offers I have received. things t at . Christians I have come across in life.
When BU family were talking talking about Haiti, Christians in Barbados and other places were quietly giving. And they did not let their left hand know what their right hand was doing.
Re Christians like NON CHRISTIANS are quite comfortable being caught up in their worldly possessions. Are you not like them? Hence you are straining your brain to pass an exam so that you can have more possessions
But you see GP…I am not a Christian
That is no excuse. If you think a Christian is a sinner YOU SHOULD BE ALSO WITHOUT SIN. When the wicked men brought the woman caught in adultery to Jesus HE TO:LD THEM LET HIM THAT IS WITHOUT SIN CAST THE FIRST STONE!
You want to sit in judgement on Christians and use the excuse that you are not a Christian?
Again your standard of argument and logic ought to be on a higher plain man.
And you are wrong Techie I DID NOT sprain my brain to get through medical school. I wish I had. Id be better off. The real estate I acquired because after studying I needed to do physical work and I didn’t think that making money in medicine as some do was the way to go, so I used to physically work.
BTW I don’t think that believers (or non believers) should be poor. Many Bible characters were wealthy Abraham Boaz Lot etc The problem is putting ones wealth or any thing before Christ. That is idolatry.
I wish you well in your studies and your business and family life etc
But I want to see you rise from amidst the morass exhibited by many of the morons on BU. I like a good fair fight.
I used to love to go to court.
I always made sure my notes were clear accurate, and I always told the truth. In other words I was not there to support the Crown’s case. So I never tried to twist or speculate with the facts. There were particular lawyers from whom I always learned something – even stuff about forensic techniques. And I always told them so afterwards, after we got out side after a ding dong tustle.
I enjoy when the professionals come on BU and give their information. Guess what the Wikiepediers on BU challenge them. You know what happens when you try that wid de GP. Its nonsense
BTW Techie
ALL CHRISTIANS ARE SINNERS
They are sinners saved by grace, and serious Christians struggle with sin as Paul did and as he discusses in Romans 7
BUT ITS BETTER TO BE A SAINT [seperated one’ than an AINT anytime.
Next time you go to NYC I coming up there and I will work on you along with your mom.
Back to you David
Read the post I directed at you again.
I said you must be provocative, and you know full well that you post stuff to keep the thread going or fire up discussion, from time to time. I do the same sometimes so I can beat up on the bar raiser LOL
You posted a paragraph posted by the idiot who tries to show that he is well read. And I tore it t0 pieces for you to show that he was talking nonsense, and that is goo was contrary to the Bible.
I was not arguing Theology with you. Just suggesting that you not be found stranded down the wicket parrotting the words of someone who is talking nonsense.
My friends at church will tell you that I take them aside like Priscilla and Acquilla did to Apollos in Acts 18 “and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly. ”
Most folk here misunderstand Zoe and I
Our position is quite simple. Its like listening to a heart. When listening to a heart we listen for the first heart sound and then for the second heart sound and then for other sounds.
The first or second sound is either absent, normal, soft or loud. There are either OTHER sounds or not.
Having determined these things the INTERPRETATION IS CLEAR.
In making a diagnosis we bring facts from the history together to distinguish a from b from c from d etc
THE MORE FACTS YOU HAVE THE CLEARER THE DIAGNOSIS
Same with Bible. If you want to talk about Isaac you can start in Hebrews 11. 20. which gives a summary of his life
By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau concerning things to come.
Then you can follow his story in Genesis 18-26 and stress that he was a beautiful type of the Lord in a general
sense , because Isaac, like Christ he was :
The Promised son Genesis 18:10
The Unique or only son Genesis 22:2
The Beloved son Genesis 22:2
The Obedient son Genesis 22
The offered son Genesis 22:8-9
The married son Genesis 24
The empowered Son Genesis 25:5
Having assembled the facts and set out a great outline as the one above, you can launch a discussion, and wait for men WHO HAVE SEARCED AND STUDIED to flesh out the outline from thier arduous and life long study of the NT.
If a man strays, he can be easily discerned. Its not that we know everything. Some chaps might disagree but believe me they will come with a relevent discussion supported by several scriptures.
And when you engage in such exercises extemporaneously every Sunday morning debunkinf false teachers who claim to be well read on BU is like drinking soup. Easy so David
de hood
You have the sense to pick some sense from the abundant nonsense spewed out on this thread . You quoted from Expatriate thus
“We as black men have to step up to the mantle of responsibility in our homes, and lead by example..” and you added
I would add, not only in the homes, but in the wider community as well.
I must agree with you on what you said about blacks here, there and everywhere?
Blacks everywhere are guilty of the crab in the barrel syndrome. Lot of talk and very little positive or collective action. We display a lack of support for each other
But leave ROKie hiding out wherever he is. I aint got the time to whip him anymore and debunk the junk he brings to BU.
Zoe
You have wisely used King’s quotes against the unlearned on this thread as well as the so called educated bar raiser .
You wrote
As Dr. Martin Luther King, so aptly said:
“Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere IGNORANCE and conscientious STUPIDITY.” emphasis added.
Again, as Dr. King so correctly stated:
“Over and over again the Bible reminds us of the danger of zeal without KNOWLEDGE (i.e., ignorance) and sincerity without intelligence.” emphasis added.
You are correct in pointing out that only by diligent study and right division of the Word can one apply it properly.
We hear so much about King’s dream and his death and his marches and speeches, but how did he apply the Word in a practical way, as taught in the NT. The early church were accused of being “communists” because they shared their goods. We are told in Acts that they had all things in common. We are told that they continued steadfastly IN THE APOSTLES DOCTRINE, And THE BREAKING OF BREAD And in PRAYERS.
Yet re read on this thread THAT PRAYER IS NONSENSE. This is despite the fact that PETER WAS RELEASED FROM PRISON because the church prayed for him. This is despite the fact that PAUL perennially asked for prayer. This is despite the testimony of myriads who can tell of the answer to their prayers.
This is despite the fact that George Mueller of Bristol ran an orphanage on PRAYER and was never out of food
What did ML King do apart from walking around marching and making speeches. He was this great Theologian who attended three colleges. But much of the Theology from the excerpts posted on this thread is at variance with NT Theology as practiced in the early church and ever since.
From reading the NT it seems that they put a lot of emphasis on the WORD OF GOD. The reason why the church is weak today is BECAUSE IT DOES NOT STUDY THE WORD OF GOD NOR DO THEY PRACTICE IT. THIS IS ESPECIALLY SO IN THE USA.
How can the church know without teachers who are sold out on the Word.
How can the church lead unless it is composed of REGENERATED BELIEVERS ENCOURAGING EACH OTHER AS TAUGHT IN HEBREWS 10!
Re to that poster, who stupidly, ignorantly, and in obvious spiritual blindness, said:
“Any respectable theologian or deep reader of things theological knows that the Bible is suspect and not used as seminal material.”
You will notice I mocked this twit with a pea sized brain who does not know that it is anathema that any institution that says it is a Theological Seminary ought to be teaching the Bible. It is indeed true that “The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. But FOOLS despise wisdom and instruction.” (Prov. 1:7)
This applies not only to those who admit to be unlearned, but those who claim to be so highly learned but who seem incapable of adequate analysis, and totally unable to understand what they are reading.
Real scholars are able to SIFT OUT TRUTH FROM WOFFLE AND THE PERSONAL OPINION OF OTHERS, HOWEVER “FAMOUS”.
Hey man don;t get ahead of yourself in trying to debunked Dr. Kings message with bible quotes and references. King is trying to reach the hearts and minds of those who were intolerant of peoplesrights and in so doing have applied principles which he himself might to become a better person. It is not as if he is making himself equal with God. Sometimes people interact with each better by showing themselves as human. Apparently you have missed the real purpose of Dr. King message. It was about Loving and having .respect for Each Other.
@GP
Are you likening the BU family to the Sadducees and Pharisees?
Winning hearts and souls is hard work man.
Why resort to the heavy approach such as that used against the Sadducees and Pharisees?
By your own script ‘ There are many ways of presenting the Word‘
Interesting that Muammar Ghadaffi is now quoted as saying that he should be paid by the European Union, to prevent Africans from emigrating illegally to Europe, to prevent a ‘black Europe’.
Interesting that he has made his comments in that ‘philosophically interesting’ state of Italy, of the late Mussolini.
At the same time, he laughably paid a couple of groups of Italian women to listen to him, preach for the Islamic cause for Europe, before handing out the Quran.
Yet another nutter. The world is filled with zealots and certifiable wackos, aching for a confrontation, which will surely come.
Onward soldiers…marching….bunch of fruitcakes.
Then we have the power hungry, money grabbing right-wing, who will stop at nothing to convince the ignorant that their cause is altruistic. Even they have an audience in the redneck , shorgun carrying hicks, such as the rather portly specimen in the hick-red T-shirt, in the article photo.
What a cocktail!
@GP
I think you should apply”Jackass Braying “to yourself and while you are at included “Scoffers” thoseapply to you!
” What did DR. King do apart from marching and walking around and making speeches. are you serious. Don’t you understand that the freedom you have living in the USA and the various churches you attended is because of Dr, King
Question: The Bible has been around for hundreds of years and what did the bible do to prevent racisim and slavery. Some of the same Theologians and preachers were active racist and they never said or did a thing to stop such injustices and they quote bible verses too even using some to justify such behaviour. Now you talking about DR. King not quoting Bible .I guess he left that forhis opppressors to do . Look man You should be thanking DR. King for the freedom you so preciously enjoy in the USA. or maybe you would prefer the KKK burning Crosses on your doorstep. Jesus CHrist man ! have a heart.
David
You behaving like Techie now LOL
You are being PROVOCATIVE cause you know exactly what I am saying LOL!
Man if you really read up the passages where Jesus went after the religious leaders you will see that he was not so easy with them. Look how he dealt with Nicodemus in John 3 and cmpare to his treatment of the woman at the well in John 4, or the heavy handed whipping he put on the sabbath police in John 5, as he gave his qualifications and the proof of his deity.
Notice how he dealt with the chaps that were looking for more food in John 6 prior to the “cannabalistic commotion” and the whipping he gave those who suggested he was a bastrard in John 7, where he quoted the famous JUDGE RIGTEOUS JUDGEMENT AND NOT BY THE APPEARANCE.
As the hostility of the Jews grew he called them sons of the devil in Chapter eight, but ignored them completely at his trial.
However, I will use the easy method with the BU household.
If you are as discerning, as I think you are, you will notice I address different folk on BU differently, and that some I dont bother with at all, simply because they are not worthy of my time, except when I chose to use them as a mock stick. LOL
Some are so ignorant that they can not follow the thread of an arguement. Never met such fools at school or college or church. Only the rummies that come to my father’s house to drink after church talk so erratically and unlearnedly.
I will say this though David It is written in James 1:17
Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
Jesus said in John 3 27. A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.
David if you have a good wife, she is a GIFT THAT GOD GAVE YOU FROM HEAVEN. If you have good children ….DITTO.
I thank God and God only for all that I have. NOT ANY MAN I thank him also for that which I dont have too.
I was very sad when I had to leave the Texas Mexico border four years ago, because I had been treated unfairly. Today the Zetas are operating in the same very area. You see God removed me from the area like how he removed Lot before the destruction of Sodom & Gomorrah.
‘I was very sad when I had to leave the Texas Mexico border ‘
Oh, until I read on I wondered if you were out of your mind, sad to leave the drug-gun-toting lunatics in Mexico?
Must be hell on Earth to live there.
How selfrighteous can a person be. Who created man? according to your bible man was created in the image of God. So how can you love God and not be openly thankful for the spirit of goodness he gave to an individual in so much as to die for the very freedom s which you enjoy.Don’t you ever thank yourfriends and otherswho have done something good for you? Doesn’t the WORD say:In as much as you have done the least to them you have done it unto me!I think that should include being thankful to those who lives have affect you in a positive way.
Crusoe
Things were not that bad when I went to live in Rio Grande City. There was a nice quiet 5o mile drive to Tamilaupaus with very little traffic. The land bridge at that point is a quiet one over the Falcon Lake Dam and the town where the school was was very very sleepy, with very good and cheap food in the little restaurants.
The Texas Mexico border is relatively impoverished, with scenes in some parts similar to that seen in the poorer islands, but the further you get from Roma TExas and approach Brownsville, the towns are more like those in the rest of the USA cities.
I was very well paid and very well accomodated. Recently they killed the Governor of the state there. But when we left it was very calm at that point compared to the corresponding town over from Roma, TX where we went for our visas. That was extremly busy; with Mexicans walking over to shop in Roma and going back to the town.
GP, Okay. So sad, that greed (of the big boys) can ruin a country and lives so.
The average man must realise that they are being used and abused, for enrichment of a few.
But, twill never happen. Here, there, anywhere.
Yes you are correct Crusoe.
The border there is quite nice (or must have been before the drugs) except that the rain does not fall too often. There is a lot of cactus and aloes growing and some plants that the cattle like. Lot of rich ranchers live along parts of the border.
One nice long road from Brownsville to El Paso. I stupidly spent too much time trying to bring great stuff into the classroom since they had me teaching out of my subject area all the time. So I only got as far as Zapatta and never really went off that main road in the four months there. Expected to be there for a while. Three years would have been good for my cv and my pocket. LOL.
You would like the general area if you like peace and quiet.
That same peace and quiet, however affords opportunity to cross the river Grande. The influx of Mexicans into Texas over the years have apparently run a lot of the whites from the border. We never saw any blacks at all.
Everybody is throwing around fancy quotes from excerpts of King’s speeches. Nonetheless, when Dr King walked this earth, most of the deceit he encountered came from negroes. Let me say this to Terrence Blackett and the rest of you on this blog right now, if Jesus was living on this earth in the twenty first century, he would be denied, disowned, betrayed and ultimately crucified, just as he was more than two thousand years ago. Precious little else has changed as far as human deceny is concerned. Organized religion is the major problem among the inhabitants of this planet, more especially, europeans. Europeans, have always praised god in one breath, and passed the ammunition afterwards. All of this touchy feely caring for the enemy as you would yourself Terrence, is Slave master indoctrination. The only reason on earth that the second world war ended, was because of the atomic bomb. The countries that own nuclear weapons, know damn well, that the nuclear weapon, is protection againgst them being attacked. The irony of that is, Terrence that those nations, equipped with nuclear weaponry, will try as hard as ever, to prevent non-nuclear nations from ever developing nuclear weapons technology. “Our right, lies in our might.” Europeans don’t care who we as darker skinned people are for, as long as we’re for them and their way of life. TB, we must fight hard not to become the most comfortable slaves on the planet. Although Dr King’s dream was good in its time, is his dream still relevant and/or practical in this time? Why then don’t most of us not feel the need to ask these questions, and look for answers to assist our people in forward movement. Everything is for a time, and for a season, even Dr King’s dream.
@Expatriate
Who or whatever deceit Dr King encountered did not stop DR. King from fullfilling his dream and fighting for Truth and Justice .. Yes his dream is and will be relevant for all time. Just look at the many civil rights laws that have been passed because of Dr. King . Whites are still uncomfortable with the fact that a Black man would have weilded such power at a time when they did not care and is hell bent in seeing those rights be destroyed. What is your problem? The Dream would forever live on and there isn’t a damn thing any one can do about it.
Expatriate
You are correct when you say “Everybody is throwing around fancy quotes from excerpts of King’s speeches” What you didn’t say is that those who are throwing them around don’t seem to understand them, or that they contradict what the Scriptures teach.
You are also correct when you say “ when Dr King walked this earth, most of the deceit he encountered came from negroes. “ And nothing has changed.
It amazes me that when King attraqcted a large crowd and made his speech he was acclaimed a hero, but that when Beck did much the same, Beck is a Mormon, a WHITE RACIST a political demigod, FOX News commentator and Tea Party .
When King spoke he just had whites accompanying activist but Glen Beck had an army of predominantly Caucasian supporters gathered .”
Beck is castigated for addressing family values, low taxation and cutting the Federal deficit. family values, low taxation and cutting the Federal deficit and for peppering his speech with references to God* and the fact that it was time for American to forge a new direction references to God* and the fact that it was time for American to forge a new direction.
Beck ought to be cast into the pit JUST FOR SAYING THE TRUTH OR IS IT FOR BEING WHITE.
You are also correct when you say “ if Jesus was living on this earth in the twenty first century, he would be denied, disowned, betrayed and ultimately crucified, just as he was more than two thousand years ago. Precious little else has changed as far as human deceny is concerned. “
Neither what you or Beck has said as noted above can be DENIED or REFUTED.
You know it amazes me that you all people are ‘well learned’
There is no respect amongst thieves and murderers!!!!
AC keep on trying sigh.
Yes they are well learned except ac who seems to be mentally challenged and very emotional. She is clearly out of the league of the other posters
And none of the posters or Beck or King are/were murderers or thieves or they would be in prison.
@Anonymous | September 1, 2010 at 12:55 PM
Mr. Anonymous, Sir, let me acquaint you with a quote from LDS scripture (B.O.M. to be precise, from the from the book called Mosiah, chapter 3). Go check it out for yourself. That verse explains it all.
19 For the natural man is an enemy to God, and has been from the fall of Adam, and will be, forever and ever, unless he yields to the enticings of the Holy Spirit, and putteth off the natural man and becometh a saint through the atonement of Christ the Lord, and becometh as a child, submissive, meek, humble, patient, full of love, willing to submit to all things which the Lord seeth fit to inflict upon him, even as a child doth submit to his father.
20 And moreover, I say unto you, that the time shall come when the knowledge of a Savior shall spread throughout every nation, kindred, tongue, and people.
Since de hood and GP are such good buddies, the Book of Mormon is an approved scripture now!
@Anonymous | September 1, 2010 at 1:43 PM
Has been for almost 200 years now, Sir! And fully approved by the Lord Jesus Himself.
Get a copy, Anonymous, and have a good read. Might be the very best thing you ever did with your sorry self!
@Anonymous | September 1, 2010 at 1:43 PM
Has been for almost 200 years now, Sir! And fully approved by the Lord Jesus Himsel
By de hood on September 1, 2010 at 1:59 PM

Get a copy, Anonymous, and have a good read. Might be the very best thing you ever did with your sorry self!
By de hood on September 1, 2010 at 2:02 PM
Well aint this rich!!!
Hoodie my boy, if you think you and GP on the same page, think again!
Wunna aint even in the same library…lol.
Why would you even recommend the book of Mormon to anyone as the best thing you can do with your sorry life. By GP and Zoe’s debunking, that book is utter nonsense, not to mention the denomination…lol. Check BU for the thread.
@ GP…
Can you explain this to me….’Has been for almost 200 years now, Sir! And fully approved by the Lord Jesus Himself.’
I am confused once again.
Hi Techie,
Long time no hear. However, in reply to your scoffing all I have to say to you and everyone else is that time will tell! BTW, it ain’t long now either!!
Here is food for thought, taken from 2 Peter 3-14 :-
3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
Sorry, Techie, that quote above is from 3 Peter.
Since when has de Hood and GP been buddies? It is well known that GP and Zoe hold different opinions to de Hood on Biblical issues. But what is clear is that neither of them have opted to be stupid to try to castigate Glen Beck for his sucessful rally because he is a Mormon. I think that they didnt know that he was Mormon, and having now found out that he is, they are still more interested in the message he brought rather than his Mormonism.
I am sure that both of them were smart enough to see that ac was trying to stir up strife when she stated that Beck was a Mormon. Note that both GP & Zoe ignored the moron, and did not comment, because they were more interested in the content of Beck’s message rather than his religion. Why do you think that de Hood GP and Zoe must go to war because of the things Beck said, if thy are sensible to see that Beck’s principles were sensible?
If Beck was a BLACK Mormon would his religion have come into the equation?
Should deHood and GP be at war because GP does not favor the Book of Mormon? Did GP or Zoe say that they accept the Book of Mormon? When GP and Zoe and de Hood want to fight and war, they will do so, without your instigation.
What is very apparent here is that de Hood and GP and Zoe are of one accord with respect to the issues raised by Beck. Note that at no time did Beck say he was quoting from the book of Mormon. Note that Beck had folk of all denominations on the platform, and that the Mormon Tabernacle Choir was not featured.
It was not a Mormon rally, it was a peaceful rally.
@ Technician
BTW, I have already made it quite clear that I am well aware that Doc GP and myself do have our differences but that does not stop me from respecting what he has to say from time to time. After all, if this world was made up of all “hoods” or all “Techies” what a sad world it might be. Agree?
Techie
de Hood and GP on the same page with respect to his quote on 2 Peter 3. There is no more appropriate Scripture for him to quote with respect to this thread and the issues raised by Beck at his rally last Saturday, except that 2 Chronicles 7:14 could be added to the mix.
2 Peter 3:9 is one of my favorite Scriptures
Seems to me though, that some folk think that ‘Mormons” (BTW, that’s just a nickname for the LDS church) or Seventh Days or Jehovah Ws or Jews should not be allowed to express ANY opinions in some fora.
@ Doc GP
I believe I misquoted the scripture reference as coming from 2 Peter whereas it should really have been 3 Peter. My humble apologies to all.
De Hood
I am unaware of a 3 Peter in the KJV.
You quoted from 2 Peter chapter 3. Sir
@Doc GP
Ooopppps.
Of course, you are quite correct Doc! I actually gave the correct reference in the original comment but somehow or other got all mixed up and made a false correction. Thanks for “box on the ears” (or should that be “slap on the fingers”?).
So Jesus approved of the Book of Mormon? Can you give us the reference in the only Book that extensively records His activities and words before His ascension.
AC,
My problem is narrowed minded ignoramuses like you. You are no more than a bible toting, bible parotting intellectual midget. Plantation minded “Stepin Fetchits”like you, just don’t understand
A wealthy old Gentleman decides to go on a hunting safari in Africa, taking his faithful, elderly dog named Killer, along for the company.
One day the old dog starts chasing rabbits and before long, discovers that he’s lost. Wandering about, he notices a leopard heading rapidly in his direction with the intention of having lunch.
The old dog thinks, “Oh, oh! I’m in deep doo-doo now!”
Noticing some bones on the ground close by, he immediately settles down to chew on the bones with his back to the approaching cat. Just as the leopard is about to leap, the old dog exclaims loudly, “Boy, that was one delicious leopard! I wonder if there are any more around here?”
Hearing this, the young leopard halts his attack in mid-strike. A look of terror comes over him and he slinks away into the trees. “Whew!”, says the leopard. “That was close! That old dog nearly had me!”
Meanwhile, a monkey who had been watching the whole scene from a nearby tree, figures he can put this knowledge to good use and trade it for protection from the leopard.
So, off he goes, but the old dog sees him heading after the leopard with great speed, and figures that something must be up.
The monkey soon catches up with the leopard, spills the beans and strikes a deal for himself with the leopard.
The young leopard is furious at being made a fool of and says, “Here, monkey, hop on my back and see what’s going to happen to that conniving canine!”
Now, the old dog sees the leopard coming with the monkey on his back and thinks, “What am I going to do now?” But, instead of running, the dog sits down with his back to his attackers, pretending he hasn’t seen them yet, and just when they get close enough to hear, the old dog says…
“Where’s that damn monkey? I sent him off an hour ago to bring me another leopard!”
Moral of this story…
Don’t mess with the old dogs….. age and skill will always overcome youth and treachery, and brilliance only comes with age and experience.
When Glenn Beck became a Mormon it was due in part that he was having a hard time financially and as a favour to a friend after several times of being invited to visit the church he decided to go. It had nothing to do with becoming a born again Anything. He was simply doing his friend a favour.
The hypocrisy of the GPS and the Zoes is that all of a sudden they have seen the light because of Glenn Beck rally .After several days on Bu via another thread they left no stone unturned in debunking the Mormon Religion They need to apologise to all Mormons worldwide for the way in which they unleashed religous bigotry towards them.
Now they are on another mission trying to debunk Dr. Kings message
@hood
Leos are strong headed and independent thinkers and are not easily swayed by anyones opinion.
@techie
You too is very opinionated and have the ability to see through a person of deceit . You have a special gift of discernment. No one should take your opinions lightly for one they are well thought out
and more often that not correct.
@Gp
Your wealth of knoweldge is admirable. However you are arrogant in the way you dispense it even though you are quite to share.
@Zoe
You are a master! or shall I call you Rabbi. a good example of those who know the law and would not bend to accomodate other thinking. However Jesus did not show much respect for the writers of the Law in Bibical times.
BTW > I love all yuh
More from Martin on “A Tough Mind And A Tender Heart”
“Let us consider, first, the need for a tough mind, characterized by incisive thinking, realistic appraisal and decisive judgment. The tough mind is sharp and penetrating, breaking through the crust of legends and myths and sifting the true from the false. The tough-minded individual is astute and discerning. He has a strong, austere quality that makes for firmness of purpose and solidness of commitment.”
“Who doubts that this toughness of mind is one of man’s greatest needs? Rarely do we find men who willing engage in hard, solid thinking. There is an almost universal quest for easy answers and half-baked solutions. Nothing pains some people more than having to think.”
“Undue gullibility is also seen in the tendency of many readers to accept the printed word of the press as final truth. Few people realize that even our authentic channels of information – the press, the platform and in many instances the pulpit – do not give us objective and unbiased truth. Few people have the toughness of mind to judge critically and to discern the true from the false, the fact from the fiction. Our minds are constantly being invaded by legions of half-truths, prejudices and false facts. One of the great needs of mankind is to be lifted above the morass of false propaganda.”
“The softminded man always fears change. He feels security in the status quo, and he has an almost morbid fear of the new. For him, the greatest pain is the pain of a new idea… The softminded person always wants to freeze the moment and hold life in the gripping yoke of sameness.”
“Softmindedness often invades religion. This is why religion has sometimes rejected new truth with a dogmatic passion. Through edicts and bulls, inquisitions and excommunications, the church has attempted to prorogue truth and place an impenetrable stone wall in the path of the truth-seeker. The historical-philological criticism of the Bible is considered by the softminded as blasphemous, and reason is often looked upon as the exercise of a corrupt faculty. Softminded persons have revised the Beatitudes to read, ‘Blessed are the pure in ignorance: for they shall see God’.”
“Softmindedness is one of the basic causes of race prejudice. The toughminded person always examines the facts before he reaches conclusions: in short, he postjudges. The softminded person reaches a conclusion before has examined the first fact; in short, he prejudges and is prejudiced. Race prejudice is based on the groundless fears, suspicions and misunderstandings. There are those who are sufficiently softminded to believe in the superiority of the white race and the inferiority of the Negro race in spite of the toughminded research of anthropologists who reveal the falsity of such a notion. There are softminded persons who argue that racial segregation should be perpetuated because Negroes lag behind in academic, health and moral standards. They are not toughminded enough to realize that lagging standards are the result of segregation and discrimination. They do not recognize that it is rationally unsound and sociologically untenable to use the tragic effects of segregation as an argument for continuation…”
“There is little hope for us until we become toughminded enough to break loose from the shackles of prejudice, half-truths, and downright ignorance. The shape of the world today does not permit us the luxury of softmindedness. A nation or a civilization that continues to produce softminded men purchases its own spiritual death on an installment plan.”
@ac September 1, 2010 at 5:56 PM |
You wrote:- “Leos are strong headed and independent thinkers and are not easily swayed by anyones opinion.”
……………………………………………………………………………………………………..
OK, ac, now that you have let the cat (or lion?) out of the bag, I have no choice but to plead……..”guilty as charged”.
How are things with you? Well, I hope.
@Anonymous
Are you confusing me with someone else . The above comments you posted about me does not fit my profile.I need an explanation . No apology needed.
Terrence
Martin dead man, and after all that fancy talk blacks still seeing shhhhhhhhhhhhhhh……………… te!
ac,
Why attack the man (GB)? Look at the message. The US of A has lost its way, spiritually speaking. Apparently one cannot even mention the name of God or Jesus Christ publicly anymore for fear of offending the other minorities in the country. America is a great nation with promise, nevertheless, but “she will be forced to her knees” until “she” acknowledges the power of Almighty God once more.
@Guess who
Enjoy your story or joke.You can add this one to your list of ‘Moral of the Story” You can teach an old dog new tricks ! ah lie
On Sunday night March 8th 1968, I attended a Gospel meeting in a fledgling Baptist church in Ch Ch just to please my girl friend at the time.
I was at the time “an Anglican of the Anglicans” and written down my the rector of Ch Ch Parish Ch to surely become a priest. That night I heard a gospel message from John chapter 12, and I gave my heart to the Lord. I went from being a “confirmed sinner” to become a SAVED SINNER BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH.
If Glenn Beck was having financial difficulty and went to church to please a friend and his life was turned around, who am I to judge him.
Everyone knows that Zoe and I expressed our odeas concerning the Mormons, and we have said so. Yesterday I gave examples of how I go about coming to a decision and a decision. Because I do not agree with Mormon doctrine, I am in no war with de Hood. And if Glenn Beck said things that are correct in principle, I am not going to say now that I think he stated wrong principles because I have discovered he is a mormon. America needs to return to God.
I have been watching Beck’s show for a while. He is not the greatest orator or the smartest tool in the shed, but he certainly provides food for thought, and some interesting principles. And he does have an effect on myriads of people in the USA.
It seems that the Obama supporters are quaking because of his political teachings on his program. I find that funny too.
More from Martin on “A Tough Mind And A Tender Heart”
“Let us consider, first, the need for a tough mind, characterized by incisive thinking, realistic appraisal and decisive judgment. The tough mind is sharp and penetrating, breaking through the crust of legends and myths and sifting the true from the false. The tough-minded individual is astute and discerning. He has a strong, austere quality that makes for firmness of purpose and solidness of commitment.”
“Who doubts that this toughness of mind is one of man’s greatest needs? Rarely do we find men who willing engage in hard, solid thinking. There is an almost universal quest for easy answers and half-baked solutions. Nothing pains some people more than having to think.”
“Undue gullibility is also seen in the tendency of many readers to accept the printed word of the press as final truth. Few people realize that even our authentic channels of information – the press, the platform and in many instances the pulpit – do not give us objective and unbiased truth. Few people have the toughness of mind to judge critically and to discern the true from the false, the fact from the fiction. Our minds are constantly being invaded by legions of half-truths, prejudices and false facts. One of the great needs of mankind is to be lifted above the morass of false propaganda.”
“The softminded man always fears change. He feels security in the status quo, and he has an almost morbid fear of the new. For him, the greatest pain is the pain of a new idea… The softminded person always wants to freeze the moment and hold life in the gripping yoke of sameness.”
“Softmindedness often invades religion. This is why religion has sometimes rejected new truth with a dogmatic passion. Through edicts and bulls, inquisitions and excommunications, the church has attempted to prorogue truth and place an impenetrable stone wall in the path of the truth-seeker. The historical-philological criticism of the Bible is considered by the softminded as blasphemous, and reason is often looked upon as the exercise of a corrupt faculty. Softminded persons have revised the Beatitudes to read, ‘Blessed are the pure in ignorance: for they shall see God’.”
“Softmindedness is one of the basic causes of race prejudice. The toughminded person always examines the facts before he reaches conclusions: in short, he postjudges. The softminded person reaches a conclusion before has examined the first fact; in short, he prejudges and is prejudiced. Race prejudice is based on the groundless fears, suspicions and misunderstandings. There are those who are sufficiently softminded to believe in the superiority of the white race and the inferiority of the Negro race in spite of the toughminded research of anthropologists who reveal the falsity of such a notion. There are softminded persons who argue that racial segregation should be perpetuated because Negroes lag behind in academic, health and moral standards. They are not toughminded enough to realize that lagging standards are the result of segregation and discrimination. They do not recognize that it is rationally unsound and sociologically untenable to use the tragic effects of segregation as an argument for continuation…”
“There is little hope for us until we become toughminded enough to break loose from the shackles of prejudice, half-truths, and downright ignorance. The shape of the world today does not permit us the luxury of softmindedness. A nation or a civilization that continues to produce softminded men purchases its own spiritual death on an installment plan.”
@ Expatriate
Here is Martin’s answer to your dilemma – “Transformed Nonconformist”
“Every true Christian is a citizen of two worlds, the world of time and the world of eternity. We are, paradoxically, in the world, and yet not of the world. To the Philippians Christians, Paul wrote, ‘We are a colony of Heaven.’ They understood what he meant, for their city of Philippi was a Roman colony. When Rome wished to Romanize a province, she established a small colony of people who lived by Roman law and Roman customs and who, though in another country, held fast to their Roman allegiance. This powerful, creative minority spread the gospel of Roman culture. Although the analogy is imperfect – the Roman settlers lived within a framework of injustice and exploitation, that is, colonialism – the Apostle does not point to the responsibility of Christians to imbue an unchristian world with the ideals of a higher or more nobler order. Living in the colony of time, we are ultimately responsible to the ‘Empire of Eternity’. As Christians we must never surrender our supreme loyalty to any time bound custom or earth-bound idea, for at the heart of our universe is a higher reality – God and His Kingdom of love – to which we must be conformed.”
“This command not to conform comes, not only from Paul, but also from our Lord and Master, Jesus Christ, the world’s most dedicated nonconformist, whose ethical nonconformity still challenges the consciences of mankind.”
When an affluent society would coax us to believe that happiness consist in the size of our automobiles, the impressiveness of our homes, and the expensiveness of our clothes, Jesus reminds us, ‘A man’s life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth’.”
“When we would yield to the temptation of a world rife with sexual promiscuity and gone wild with a philosophy of self-expression, Jesus tells us that, ‘whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart’.”
“When we refuse to suffer for righteousness and choose to follow the path of comfort rather than conviction, we hear Jesus say, ‘Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness sake: for theirs is the Kingdom of Heaven’.”
“When in our spiritual pride we boast of having reached the peak of moral excellence, Jesus warns, ‘The publicans and harlots go into the kingdom of God before you’.”
“When we, through compassionless detachment and arrogant individualism, fail to respond to the needs of the underprivileged, the Master says, ‘Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me’.”
“When we allow the spark of revenge in our souls to flame up in hate towards our enemies, Jesus teaches, ‘Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you and persecute you’.”
“Everywhere and at all times, the love ethic of Jesus is a radiant light revealing the ugliness of our stale conformity”
“In spite of this imperative demand to live differently, we have cultivated a mass mind and have moved from the extreme of rugged individualism to the even greater extreme of rugged collectivism. We are not makers of history; we are made by history. Longfellow said, ‘In this world a man must either be an anvil or a hammer’, meaning that he is either a moulder of society or is moulded by society. Who doubts that today most men are anvils and are shaped by the patterns of the majority? Or to change the figure, most people, and Christians in particular, are thermometers that record or register the temperature of the majority opinion, not thermostats that transform and regulate the temperature of society.”
@Anonymous
Since you are unwilling to give an explanationon your comments
9/1@5.30p.m.Let me share some info. about ac
1. The only book i tote is my bank book
2. It donot trot. I drive a BMW.
3 I like parrots and i am over 5 ft tall . Maybe much taller than you.
4. I would not be consider a canadiate for the House of Assembly there is were you find the “”ignoramus”
5. I don’t step or fetch anything. I have others do that for me.
BTW.
Man wunna really confusing Techie man.
but GP promise to work on me in NY (going back up in 2 weeks)
From the time GP came on BU he has been teaching how to divide the Word correctly. From what this dumb person (Zoe’s words) can figure out, there is only one truth.
Cut the baloney and smoke and mirrors man, I have seen Zoe rip to threads the JWs, SDAs, Mormons and Catholics on BU, with GP in agreement. Regardless of what book you all agree on, according to Zoe and GP, Hoodie ma boy, ya loss!!….cause in the end ya still divide wrong..lol.
See, I still trying to grasp this divide thing. I have always asked questions, some out of pure innocence and some by being….ammm..wicked
I said all that to say this, by GP and Zoe’s teaching, only those who divide the word correctly will make it. Hoodie believe he too will make it yet still his division is flawed, along with so many others….who is right?
This aint like Networking where you can get the same results by different methods at all
@Hood
When some person uses a political platform all of a sudden to invoke the bible in his speeches . I find it suspect. Why did he not do the same when it was about Civil Rights in the sixties and after .
Glenn BecK speech is about Taking Back America. I wonder take it back from what. If you travelled through america there is a church in every nook and corner. Glenn Beck is a fraud whose ambition is to put america especially black into those dark days gone by. He has constantly attack the president to the point of calling him a racist. Tell me howis that going to help healed the racist wounds inflicted on blacks. Do you thinkthat kind of rheortic really helps. If he was sincere in what he said at the rally he would have started his speech by apologising to the President.He has in no way lead byexample. Using the bible is another way of gaining right wing poitical power.His message has only done more harm than good because it has serve no good purpose other than to divide the country.
@ Anonymous
Here’s Martin – “A Knock At Midnight”
“It is midnight within the social order. On the international horizon nations are engaged in a colossal and bitter contest for supremacy. Two World Wars have been fought within a generation, and the clouds of another war are dangerously low. Man now has atomic and nuclear weapons that could within seconds completely destroy the major cities of the world. Yet the arms race continues and nuclear tests still explode in the atmosphere, with the grim prospect that the very air we breathe will be poisoned by radioactive fallout. Will these circumstances and weapons bring the annihilation of the human race?”
“When confronted by midnight in the social order we have in the past turned to science for help. And little wonder! On so many occasions science has saved us. When we were in the midnight of physical limitation and material inconvenience, science lifted us to the bright morning of physical and material comfort. When we were in the midnight of crippling ignorance and superstition, science brought us the daybreak of the free and open mind. When we were in the midnight of dreadful plagues and diseases, science, through surgery, sanitation, and wonder drugs, ushered in the bright day of physical health, thereby prolonging our lives and making for greater security and physical well-being. How naturally we turn to science in a day when the problems of the world are so ghastly and ominous.”
“But alas! Science cannot now rescue us, for even the scientist is lost in the terrible midnight of our age. Indeed science gave us the very instruments that threaten to bring universal suicide. So modern man faces a dreary and frightening midnight in the social order.”
This midnight in man’s external collective life is paralleled by midnight in his internal individual life. It is midnight within the psychological order. Everywhere paralyzing fears harrow people by day and haunt them by night. Deep clouds of anxiety and depression are suspended in our mental skies. More people are emotionally disturbed today than at any other time in human history. The psychopathic wards of our hospitals are crowded, and the most popular psychologists today are the psychoanalysts…”
“The popular clergyman preaches soothing sermons on ‘How To Be Happy’ and ‘How To Relax’. Some have been tempted to revise Jesus’ command to read, ‘Go ye into all the world, keep your blood pressure down, and, lo, I will make you a well-adjusted personality’. All of this is indicative that it is midnight within the inner lives of men and women.”
It is also midnight within the moral order. At midnight colours lose their distinctiveness and become a sullen shade of grey. Moral principles have lost their distinctiveness. For moral man, absolute right and absolute wrong are a matter of what the majority is doing. Right and wrong are relative to likes and dislikes and the customs of a particular community. We have unconsciously applied Einstein’s theory of relativity, which properly described the physical universe, to the moral and ethical realm.”
“Midnight is the hour when men desperately seek to obey the eleventh commandment, ‘Thou shalt not get caught’. According to the ethic of midnight, the cardinal sin is to be caught and the cardinal virtue is to get by. It is all right to lie, but one must lie with real finesse. It is all right to steal, if one is so dignified that, if caught, the charge become embezzlement, not robbery. It is permissible even to hate, if one so dresses his hating in the garments of love that hating appears to be loving. The Darwinian concept of the survival of the fittest has been substituted by a philosophy of the survival of the slickest. This mentality has brought a tragic breakdown of moral standards, and the midnight of moral degeneration deepens.”
Glenn Beck was a Catholic. In 1999 he became a mormon. So it took him11 yrs to figure what he is saying about America The Beautifu from sea to Shining Sea. Give me a break.
Dr King had a real reason and a real message to bring to the Ameican people. Not some cooked up nonsense like what Glenn Beck is spewing.
Techie
We have all seen Zoe rip to threads the JWs, SDAs, Mormons and Catholics on BU, with GP in agreement
But neither of us has said that if you don’t divide the Word like us that you are lost. We have both said that salvation has to do with believing on the Lord by grace through faith as the Bible teaches in Ephesians 2:8 and other places.
There are doubtless individuals in all denominations that believe in Christ by faith despite holding their denominational dogma.
There are also lots of folk who live morals lives who do not beieve in Christ by faith.
But neither of us has said that if you don’t divide the W
ord like us that you are lost.
Well, I will be honest and state now for the record that I thought all along that was what you and Zoe were trying to prove…well slap me and call me stupid!!
There are doubtless individuals in all denominations that believe in Christ by faith despite holding their denominational dogma.
There are also lots of folk who live morals lives who do not believe in Christ by faith.
This last part had me smiling though but one question GP…will these others, who believe in Christ by faith but dividing the word incorrectly, make it to the Pearly Gates?
Generally speaking, a person will do what they believe. If a person fails to do something, anything, it’s because for the most part they did not believe enough, that it was worth their time or their effort. Also, “A person convinced againgst their will, is of the same opinion still.” Most of us refuse to accept the one thing that is constant in life, change. We look at change with the same level of difficulty, as we do brain surgery. Dr King was one of the greatest men in history, cetrainly in USA history. But, there are those that refuse to tweak his dream for the twenty first century. It is as if some of you are woefully stuck in the past. Allow Dr King his time honored ceremony, but also know that he also made mistakes, and that his dream, although great, did not start out that way. Long before Dr King, there were folks like David Walker, who at the height of the American Revolution, challenged Thomas Jefferson. We must endeavor to know the history of ourselves, before we crown some folks, as the saviors of our race. Why is Martin King so revered, and not Malcolm X? Maybe, it’s because Malcolm was speaking truth to power in ways that, annoyed the black church folks. Some of us black folks, are whiter than snow, and more protective of the status quo, than the people that own the status quo. Every now and then we should dabble into the thought of perhaps, tweaking things just a little bit. Perhaps, by trying and entertaining different ideas, we may find a new age of leaders in our midst.
My name is MARTIN
I have a tough mind, characterized by incisive thinking, realistic appraisal and decisive judgment. My mind is sharp and penetrating, breaking through the crust of legends and myths and sifting the true from the false. I am astute and discerning with a strong, austere quality that makes for firmness of purpose and solidness of commitment, BUT I AM DEAD! And my followers are a stupid as a do do bird Did I die like a fool?
I do not doubt that toughness of mind is one of man’s greatest needs. And I am one of a rare breed willing to engage in hard, solid thinking. I don’t believe in the universal quest for easy answers and half-baked solutions. I like to kick against the pricks, and bash my head against the wall. SO NOW I AM DEAD! And my followers are a stupid as a do do bird Did I die like a fool?
I am not unduly gullible and I know that the tendency of many readers to accept the printed word of the press as final truth is nonsense. I am one of the few people who realize that even our authentic channels of information – the press, the platform and in many instances the pulpit – do not give us objective and unbiased truth I am one of the few I am one of the few people with the toughness of mind to judge critically and to discern the true from the false, the fact from the fiction. My mind is never invaded by legions of half-truths, prejudices and false facts. It has been lifted above the morass of false propaganda.” BUT I AM DEAD! And my followers are a stupid as a do do bird. Did I die like a fool?
I am definitely not a softminded man who always fears change or think that security is to be found in the status quo; nor do I have any fear of the new. But since 1963 I have been frozen and my life is held in the gripping yoke of sameness. For I am dead. And my followers are a stupid as a do do bird. Did I die like a fool?
Tech
If my memory serves me correct. Ido remember GP and Zoe callking those who divide the word not in accordance with their teaching “Flase teachers “of the word.. So therefore those teachers would be lost until they are able to divide the word accordingly.
By their theological teachings The Mormons would be lostas their Bible teachings are at odds with some of traditional christian teachings .
@ Techie
“But neither of us has said that if you don’t divide the word like us that you are lost.”
************************ROTFL************************
What divide what word what Techie??!!
…..and still can’t tell you why God made the devil?
…..and still can’t fathom why Jesus deliberately spoke in parables to confuse and mislead those listening….
…..and still on about some ‘trinity’?
….. GP and Zoe are just as confused as the rest of us….. They are just not brave enough to admit it.
Techie
one question GP…will these others, who believe in Christ by faith but dividing the word incorrectly, make it to the Pearly Gates?
Techie the yardstick is to accept Christ by grace through faith.
Heree is a scenario. Do you know that many folk who genuinely accepted Christ as Savior in mass evangelical meetings have had no proper follow up teaching? Guess what ? They wrongly divide the Word.
2 Timothy 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
The command is to RIGHTLY DIVIDE THE WORD, not divide it like Zoe and I.
No where does the Scripture teach that those who wrongly divide the word are lost.
If a person had correctly divided the Word they would know this . Would they not?
Here is logic at its zenith
Zoe and GP believe the Trinity- a doctrine accepted from the beginning of both Christianity and Christendom.
CONCLUSION: Zoe & GP are confused.
Zoe & GP allegedly do not know why God made the devil or do not share the view of the most omnisient one.
CONCLUSION Zoe & GP are confused.
Zoe & GP have demonstrated over and over that they have a good grasp of the Scripture
CONCLUSION Zoe & GP are confused.
Some of you may be confused. But I am not. And the one who is behind the confusion is certainly not confused either.
So since you and Zoe come on BU as having correctly divide the word. The term Rightly Dividing The word Should be applied to both of You as it is almost impossible for others of differing faiths or “Dividers Of The Word” to be in agreement with your theology.
The command is to RIGHTLY DIVIDE THE WORD, not divide it like Zoe and I.
No where does the Scripture teach that those who wrongly divide the word are lost.
If a person had correctly divided the Word they would know this . Would they not?
By Georgie Porgie on September 1, 2010 at 9:49 PM
Have to admit GP…I am at a lost trying to understand this.
Its very simple Techie
Here you are a teenager. You know nothing except you have some sense of right or wrong.
You meet some street preachers or you go to church to please your girl friend.
You hear a Gospel message the basic tenants of which are
1 You are a sinner
2 The Bible teaches that the soul that sinneth it shall die- spiritually and be separated from God for eternity
3 You can not save yourself
4 Christ died to save you. Salvation is by Christ alone It is a gift of God by grace which you asccept by faith.
You have a choice. You can debunk the above as gunk.
Or you can accept Christ by faith.
Maybe you do. Can you divide the Word rightly at that time ? NO. Do you get saved by rightly dividing the Word NO. Do you have to know who created the devil? NO You need only to accept that Christ died to save your sinful soul.
Folk who genuinely do this experience a change in thier lives.
Most of these folk continue in the the Word as directed in John 8:31. Many of these will read the Word for themselves. OTHERS WILL SEARCH IT AND STUDY IT SEQUENTIALLY AND SYSTEMATICALLY.
OVER TIME THEY BEGIN TO GROUP SIMILAR SCRIPTURES TO GETHER Thery learn to CUt it straight or RIGHTLY DIVIDE IT.
For examples you might over time note certain scriptures teach the eternal security of the believer, or the concept of the sealing of the Spirit, or the virgin birth, or the millennium or the antichrist etc
In a good teaching church these things are taught. Maybe you would buy books and read commentaries just as you might do for your hobby or school work or vocatin and you might learn faster. Hope this helps
If you had to rightly divide the Word to be saved who wouuld be saved?
Remember the Phillipian jailor asked Paul WHAT MUST I DO TO BE SAVED
PAUL REPLIED BELIEVE ON THE LORD JESUS CHRIST AND THOU SHALT BE SAVE
Some folk will try to interpret it by Some
@ Techie
“No where does the Scripture teach that those who wrongly divide the word are lost.”
Actually I think it does. See the excerpt, but you should read the entire chapter to make sure I’m not pulling a fast one.
2Jn 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
2Jn 1:8 Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward.
2Jn 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
2Jn 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
2Jn 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
It is clear Beck is pushing and emotional rhetoric to mobilize the conservative of America.
It is interesting to date he has succeeded in mobilizing White hick America.
It is interesting the same base which is captivated by his message are very receptive to Sarah Palin.
Beck is another Limbaugh, another nutcase produced by the land of the free.
To be discussing Beck in the same breath as MLK a man who demonstrated he cared by his repeated actions he cared is nonsense.
All this diatribe just to support Glen Beck’s attack on Obama. Is it only now that America needs to get back to God? Are we to believe that only with Obama’s election has America moved away from God? It is implied that America at sometime in the past was firmly and totally with God. Yet it is notable and an indisputable fact that one of most egregious failings of America of the past was its mistreatment of minorities, particularly people of African descent. It is thus incredible that we are told that America needs to RETURN to God and only now that Obama is President. This advice from some on this blog is accompanied by an attack on one of the most revered symbols of the opposition to racism. If someone wants to support Beck that is their right. I have no problem with anyone opposing Obama but what is disconcerting that some feel that they have to pull down the work of Martin Luther King in order justify their support of Beck and opposition to Obama. They vehemently excoriate Dr King’s written words for not being Biblically consistent and ask “what has King done other than organise marches and make speeches?”. However for them, they “have been watching Beck’s show for a while. He is not the greatest orator or the smartest tool in the shed, but he certainly provides food for thought, and some interesting principles. And he does have an effect on myriads of people in the USA.”
Some may fervently deny it but for them, an America racist in law, supportive of the exclusive right of white, male, Christian persons to occupy positions of authority and power, uncritically supportive of capitalist exploitation of labour and natural resources and the relentless use of American military and financial power in the support of a Zionist Israel is an America that is well with God.
@ Anonymous
” Some may fervently deny it but for them, an America racist in law, supportive of the exclusive right of white, male, Christian persons to occupy positions of authority and power, uncritically supportive of capitalist exploitation of labour and natural resources and the relentless use of American military and financial power in the support of a Zionist Israel is an America that is well with God.”
Powerful STUFF!!!
Just slightly OFF-TOPIC* but look at the RELIGIOUS RIGHT’s MAJOR Concerns: MONEY* –
No denying the above video clip cites many facets of fiscal and monetary truth but for Christians the dichotomy between “provision” and Providence* sometimes gets pretty blurred…
But some may argue that there is sufficient reason given the FED’s Central Bank Gov’s latest declaration:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11146577
NO PROPHET IS ACCEPTED IN HIS OWN COUNTRY OR ELSEWHERE FOR THAT MATTER!!!
Will Glenn Beck’s Creepy “Black Robe Regiment” Use Churches to Sway Voters?
http://www.alternet.org/teaparty/148049/will_glenn_beck%27s_creepy_%22black_robe_regiment%22_use_churches_to_sway_voters
@ Terence M. Blackett/ September 2, 2010 at 12:28 PM |
You wrote:- “NO PROPHET IS ACCEPTED IN HIS OWN COUNTRY OR ELSEWHERE FOR THAT MATTER!!!”
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………
Please enlighten me ,Sir. To which prophet are you referring in particular?
@Anon | September 1, 2010 at 11:34 PM |
Read the text you cite again and see how ignorant you are, Sir.
Read it again and see thay YOU yourself have not RIGHTLY DIVIDED THE WORD OF TRUTH.
Note well verse 7
. For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh
These deceivers and antichrist FAILED TO CONFESS THAT JESUS CAME IN THE FLESH. They failed to believe in the incarnation of Christ- a major truth in the doctrine of Christ and the doctrine of salvation. These folk are not saved. How can they rightly divide the Word without the Spirit Of God?
Now look at verse 9
abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God.
How can one abide in a doctrine in which they never got started? Cf John 8:31 and Philipians 2:12
Return to your mark and run in again.
@ Doc GP
Please help me here,Dr. Am I reading that scripture reference, from 2 Jn,1 given by Anon, correctly? Somehow I don’t understand it to mean that ANYONE is lost there. What I understand that reference to mean is that such folk may find themselves in some serious trouble with God if they persist in such behaviour/beliefs. Correct?
Oh Most Brilliant David!
Re It is clear Beck is pushing and emotional rhetoric to mobilize the conservative of America
Question. Did MLK push an emotional rhetoric too? Whom did he seek to mobilize? Did he seek to mobilze anyone.
If MLK had the right to push an emotional rhetoric to mobilize anyone in his day, does Beck have the right to push an emotional rhetoric in our day too?
Re It is interesting the same base which is captivated by his message are very receptive to Sarah Palin.
Is this sinful or morally wrong?
Re Beck is another nutcase produced by the land of the free.
To be discussing Beck in the same breath as MLK a man who demonstrated he cared by his repeated actions he cared is nonsense.
But we have a whole thread in direct response to A VERY SUCCESSFUL RALLY THAT HE HELD ON SATURDAY
How do we know that Beck does not care for his country?
Is it because he is white?
The great MLK the orator the scholar the brilliant of the brilliant held a rally, He is exalted
.
Now a “nutcase from nowhere who is a self confessed drunkard : who is obviously not smart and clearly not the smartest tool in the shop HELD A RALLY TOO1 And he is being condemned on BU because he is WHITE?
Help me out here, man. The logic evades me.
de Hood
Anon is a biblical galactosemic with spiritual lactose intolerance. He is picking seeds, but does not know what they are about. Not only has he wrongly divided the Word he is very far in the ocean.
Permit me to share some pages from my personal commentary on 2 John written in 2000 as part of my MDiv studies.
2 JOHN 7. For many deceivers have gone out into the world, men who will not acknowledge the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh; such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist.
In this section, we have the answer to the lady’s question. Having assured the elect lady that believers are commanded of the Lord to love one another, John now proceeds to the main subject of his letter. What should be the attitude of the Christian toward the “many deceivers” who “are entered into the world” (v.7) ? In the name of love, should he treat them with Christian hospitality?
In 2 John 7, John moves from encouraging truth to opposing error. He begins with the conjunction “for,” indicating that the following statement is the reason for heeding the exhortation of verses 5-6. Believers are to cultivate genuine love for one another because “many deceivers are entered into the world” (v. 7) As in I John 4: 1, John is referring to the fact that many false teachers are traveling from place to place propagating their error. John’s idea is that with the truth known and dwelling in us, and with a walk in consistency with the truth, we shall be prepared to detect and refuse the many deceivers that have gone out into the world.
In dealing with deceivers and false teachers, one must first recognize the nature of the error. John teaches that there are only two fundamental types of Christian perversions. All Christian error and heresies gather about one or the other of these.
1.There are, first of all, those who are deceived about the person of the Lord Jesus. There is one sign of the true redeemer and savior — he is the one who came from God into the world and became man. The incarnation is an essential doctrine of Christian faith. If you can trace a man’s origin from his birth, and you know that he entered this human stream though the normal reproductive faculties, and he claims to be a savior, you can write him off, because he is not God’s savior. And if he claims not to believe nor to accept this incarnation of the Lord Jesus, then the man is in error. No matter what else he may say, he is not speaking as the spokesman of God.
Throughout the New Testament, all the apostles set the incarnation at the center of Christian theology — the Word becoming man. Everything else revolves around the person of the Lord Jesus. John says, if a man does not teach this , no matter what else he may say, he is a deceiver. Now he may be deceived as well as being a deceiver, but he is an antichrist, because he is against the doctrine of Jesus. Therefore, he is to be recognized for what he is — a man who is mistaken and trying to deceive others.
2 John 7 reads similarly to 1 John 2:18-26 and 4:1-3.It teaches that there are ‘deceivers’ and ‘antichrists’, who work and speak against Christ, and who have ‘gone out into the world’ with their teaching, just as the true followers of Christ have been sent into the world to take the gospel to all people (see Matthew 28:19-20 and John 17:18). These false teachers denied what is at the very centre of Christianity, ‘the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh’. That is, they denied that Jesus, the Son of God, really became Man for us. They said that He only seemed to be Man.. They denied that He suffered and died as man for us men and women. John wants us to beware of the denial of Christ.
2 John continued
2.The other type of error, that gathers around a misunderstanding or false conception of the teaching of the Lord Jesus is that “ Any one who goes ahead [literally, goes beyond] and does not abide in the doctrine [the teaching] of Christ does not have God. (2 Jn 1:9 RSV) This certainly takes care of all groups that hold that the Bible is not an adequate revelation of God, and that say we need something else. Such impostors are often very persuasive and sincere and may even be very charismatic with great personalites , but they do not abide in the doctrine of Christ, therefore they are not of God. There are many people today who say that the teachings of the Scriptures are infantile, and that modern man can no longer accept the simplistic teachings of the Bible. The contemporary mind seeks satisfaction in more scientific approaches. This is exactly what John is talking about here? Anyone who goes beyond, or departs from the revelation of Jesus, and considers it too simple, and tries to add something to the teachings of the Word of God. John wants us to beware of thinking that there is truth greater than the truth of Christ.
In 2 John 7, John teaches that the presence of the deceivers is marked by their doctrine. This verse teaches also that they have been sent into the world, that they are seducing deceiving impostors, and that they are many in number. John’s description of them agrees with that of Peter (2 Peter 2:and Jude) in these respects as well as the denial in which they engage and their mission to repudiate the truth of Christ’s coming. John alone refers to them as antichrist. It is imperative that we appreciate that the word deceiver implies much more than teaching false doctrine. It also includes leading people into wrong living, because wrong doctrine leads to wrong living. We are what we believe and what we have learned. Truth and life go together. What we believe determines how we behave. Wrong doctrine and wrong living always go together
Deceivers are exposed by their attitude to Christ. They assert that Jesus Christ was a good Man, but refuse to confess that He is “come in flesh.” To confess that Jesus Christ is come in flesh is to own that He pre-existed as God before He became flesh. There would be no sense in saying of a mere human being that he is come in flesh. How else could he come? But to deny that Jesus Christ is come in flesh is thus to deny His previous existence, and therefore the denial that He is GOD! The one who denies this great truth concerning Christ at once exposes himself as “a deceiver and an anfichrist”.
John wants all to know that there can be no Chritianity with a diminished Christ. A Jesus any less than God in flesh appeanng cannot be a Saviour. Any doctrine which takes away from Christ’s full deity is no doctrine at all. It is antichristian, destructive. In I John 4:2, the tense was different. There it was” come” or “has come” in the flesh, as though to stress the historic, fact of the Incarnation. Now he uses the present tense ‘coming,’ as though that act, like Calvary, was somehow timeless. Jesus is always the Messiah. We must always, day by day look to him to see God. ( Blaiklock p 117 )
For the Christian, Christ is the Truth. Many others may bring to us what is in some way true and helpful. We can be helped in many ways to gain parts of the truth. But the Christian believes that Christ is ‘the Truth’. God spoke through His prophets in Old Testament days. Wise men and women of all nations have helped people towards the truth and have taught us to love the good and to hate evil. But the Christian believes that once and for all God has, spoken to us and has brought the Truth to us most perfectly by sending His own Son Jesus Christ. As Hebrews 1:1-2 puts it, ‘In many and-various ways God spoke of old to our fathers by the prophets; but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son.’ Others speak God’s word as His messengers; He is the living Word of God (John 1: 1, 14, 18), the very Son of God. ‘The elder’ had to emphasize this because there were those who were denying the truth of Christ, and who were saying that you could go on from, Christ to higher truth. He tells ‘the elect lady and her children’ to beware of both these teachings. (Foulkes p 105)
J. B. Philips’way of translating verse 10 is to describe such a false teacher as one ‘who is so “advanced” that he is not content with what Christ taught’. He is not content with what Christ taught or with what Christ is. Such people were saying that Christ was only one of God’s messengers, only one of those through whom people came to God. The true Christian, on the other hand; believes that he has in Christ all that he needs or could ever ask for. Others may be messengers; Christ is the living Word. Others may be servants of God; Christ is the Son of God. To think that anyone is higher than Him is to make a great mistake. For when we have Him we have God, as verse 9 puts it; we have ‘both the Father and the Son’ (see also I John 2:23 and 5:12). The only wise way for us is to ‘abide in the doctrine of Christ’ and let Him be the Foundation for the whole of our life, our understanding, our faith, our works, our actions. The apostle Paul says this (in I Corinthians 3: 1 1) when he says, no other foundation can any one lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ’. Foulkes p 105
2 JOhn continued
Let us below see if we can summarize the facts about deceiving, false teaching, anti-Christian impostors.
• The presence of such deceivers was predicted by Jesus in the Olivet Discourse and Paul in Acts 20:28.
• These deceivers exist.
• These deceivers are successful! They are many! This is because as Peter 2:2 says many shall follow their
pernicious ways.” Because fallen human nature wants to believe lies and resist God’s truth and because as taught in 2 Peter 2 the apostates use devious methods to seduce unwary and unstable people.
• These deceivers are “antichrists’ (see 1 John 2:18-29). The Greek prefix anti means both “instead of’ and “against.’ These teachers are against Christ because they deny that He is indeed God come in the flesh (see 1 John 4:16). These deceivers and antichrists work and speak against Christ
• These deceivers originate in the church ; “Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them” (Acts 20:30). John says in 2 John 7 that “For many deceivers have gone out into the world” (literal translation). They went out from the church! At one time, they professed to believe “the faith which was once delivered unto the saints” ( Jude 3), but they turned from that faith and abandoned the truth and the church. “They went out from us, but ( because ) they were not of us” (1 John 2:19). They have ‘gone out into the world’ with their teaching, just as the true followers of Christ have been sent into the world to take the gospel to all people (see Matthew 28:1920 and John 17:18).
• .False teachers have chosen not to abide in the truth. To abide in the truth means to remain true to the basic doctrines of the Christian faith. The false teachers had departed from the truth and from the church fellowship and, therefore, they were dangerous.
• The false teachers have in addition given their converts a “substitute Christ’ who is not the Christ of the Christian faith.These false teachers were not only denying that Jesus Christ was really Man. They were also saying that you can ‘go ahead’ from the teaching of Christ to higher truth.
• “It takes constant spiritual vigilance to protect a family or a local church from the insidious attacks of false teachers. One very successful pastor told me, “If I took my eyes off this work for twenty-four hours and stopped praying, it would be invaded before we knew it.’ He was not emphasizing his own importance (though godly pastors are essential to spiritual churches) but the importance of diligence and vigilance.” ( Wiersbe)
• False teachers deny the truth about Christ– These are individuals who “confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh.” This is the same as saying that these (receivers are denying the truth of the incarnation (cf. I John 2:22). The heresy of which 2 John speaks is the identical Gnostic error refuted in I John 4:2-3. False teachers such as Cerinthus refused to believe that the divine Christ actually came in human flesh. That John is not speaking of the second coming of Christ is evident for several reasons. (1) We know of no first century heresy which denied a second coming in flesh. (2) The Gnostics did deny that the first coming was a coming in flesh. (3) The perfect tense “is come” in the parallel passage (I John 4:2) points back to the first advent. (4) Flesh is more normally used of the mortal human body than of the immortal resurrection body. These false teachers denied what is at the very centre of Christianity, ‘the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh’. That is, they denied that Jesus, the Son of God, really became Man for us. They said that He only seemed to be Man . How great our loss would be if they were right! He would not have shared our life and known in experience our weaknesses and temptations. He would not have suffered and died as man for us men and women.”
• All who reject the incarnation of Christ are characterized as “the deceiver and the antichrist”.
• In John’s writings he ‘John means to lump together all of the Gnostics and describe them as the deceiver and the Antichrist par excellence. This is to say that the Gnostic heresy is the product of the archenemy of God and His people. It comes from Satan himself and is propagated by the spirit of Antichrist which is even now abroad in the world (I Jn 4:3). Gnosticism denied that Jesus Christ had come in the flesh; it denied the humanity of the Lord Jesus Christ. Cerinthian Gnosticism taught that Jesus was a man on whom the Spirit came at His baptism and left at His crucifixion. Docetic Gnosticism denied the reality of the manhood of Jesus. It taught that He was just a phantom, a figment of the imagination.
The first question you want to ask any teacher, preacher, or author is, ‘What do you think about Christ? Is He God come in the flesh?’ If he hesitates, or if he denies that Jesus is God come in the flesh, then you can be sure you have a false teacher.
Verse 7 clearly tells of the two types of error which false teachers propagate and points out the dangers the church and its members face because of deceivers the world; verse 8 teaches about the danger which will beffall us if we fall into this kind of error.
Anonymous |
All this diatribe just to support Glen Beck’s attack on Obama.
Is it only now that America needs to get back to God?
NO AMERICA NEEDED TO GET BACK TO GOD A LONG TIME AGO AND THIS IS AS GOOD A TIME AS ANY. Ah lie. I know that it is too late. But still they have the right to hold on to 2 Chronicles 7:14.
Are we to believe that only with Obama’s election has America moved away from God?
NO THEY MOVED AWAY FROM GOD LONG AGO. IS IT WRONG FOR BECK OR ANYONE ELF TO CALL THEM BACK?
Why is it that the followers of MLK have not done so? Did they fail to execute on 2 Timothy 2:2? LOL
It is implied that America at sometime in the past was firmly and totally with God.
NOT AT ALL . BUT THEY ARE AWAY FROM GOD. SO BECK HAS EVERY RIGHT TO CALL THEM BACK TO GOD AS HE DIDLAST SATURDAY. LOL
It is thus incredible that we are told that America needs to RETURN to God and only now that Obama is President.
WHY DO YOU ASSERT THUS? SURELY AMERICA NEEDS TO SEEK GOD’s FACE REGARDLESS TO WHO IS PRESEIDENT.
I have not pulled down the work of Martin Luther King in order justify their support of Beck and opposition to Obama
I HAVE GIVEN MY OPINION AND I DO NOT CARE THAT IT DOES NOT COINCIDE WITH YOURS
KING IS DEAD WHY ARE WE RAISING HIM FROM THE DEAD WHEN BECK HELD HIS SUCESSFUL RALLY? You mean that only ML Km can hold rallies?
WHY THE FEAR OF BECK? I repeat He is not the greatest orator or the smartest tool in the shed
WHY THE FEAR THAT ALL THOSE WHITES WHO ATENDED ON SUNDAY WILL RETURN TO THEIR HOMES AND HURCHES AND TOWNS AND VOTE AGAINST OBAMA IN UPCOMING ELECTIONS. Didn’t they vote for him in 2008?
Why do you fear that that they will listen to “THE NUT CASE BECK NOW” ? LOL
You guys are funny, and I am having a ball here. Your rantings wont stop Pailin or The Tea Party or The Black Robed Men
I expressed my opinion that king’s written words for not being Biblically consistent BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT!
And Yes I watch Becks show It is quite entertaining. Very much like BU. LOL
And he does certainly provides food for thought, and some interesting principles especially about the use of College Professors in the indoctrination of young students for 40 years. I have been hearing that for years BUT HE READ FROM DOCUMENTS ABOUT IT.
If Beck as you say to be supportive of the exclusive right of white, male, Christian persons to occupy positions of authority and power, uncritically supportive of capitalist exploitation of labour and natural resources and the relentless use of American military and financial power in the support of a Zionist Israel is an America that is well with God.- is that not his right? WHAT ABOUT THE SO CALLED FREE SPEECH ON BU LOL.
Question is what are THE BLACKS WHO ARE THE SOLID STUDENTS OF THE DEAD BUT EXALTED KING DOING ABOUT IT? HOW EFFECTIVE ARE THEY AT SO DOING? LOL .
DO you think posting Kings speeches here on BU and talking bull here will stop Beck and others? Eh LOL THAT IS NONSENSE MAN LOL
Man if the BLACK PRESIDENT WAS DOING A GREAT JOB YOU THINKL THAT ALL THOSW WHITE FOLK WHO VOTED FOR THE SAME BLACK PRESIDENT WOULD NOW BE TAKING BECK SERIOUSLY?
.THE BLACKS IN THE USA CAN NOT VOTE ANYONE TO NE A PRESEIDENT? Ask Jesse James Jackson
You think those whites from the HICKIES as some one has called them in derision on this thread will vote for a black President again?
Will Beck be the cause or to blame? Don’t the whites from the HICKIES have sense? Or is it that they made a big mistake in 2008.
THERE ARE TWO SIDES TO A STORY
I HOPE YOU GOT THAT POINT. LOL
THE ONLY DEAD MAN THAT CAN CHANGE ANYTHING IS JESUS CHRIST GOT THAT…..not puny mlk LOL
Now you can cuss me as much as you like. I AINT COME HERE TO LOOK FOR VOTES OR A JOB. LOL
Thank you for your humble response GP.
Let us, however put this in context. Techie made the point that “No where does the Scripture teach that those who wrongly divide the word are lost”.
In response I made the suggestion that 2Jn 1:7 to 2Jn 1:11 does, however have something to say about that.
You then replied quite humbly I might add, by regurgitating what I have said.
Here is how:
I will skip the first section because we seem to be on the same page there. In the second section of your masterpiece you stated:
2 John continued
2.The other type of error, that gathers around a misunderstanding or false conception of the teaching of the Lord Jesus is that “ Any one who goes ahead [literally, goes beyond] and does not abide in the doctrine [the teaching] of Christ does not have God.
And
“Anyone who goes beyond, or departs from the revelation of Jesus, and considers it too simple, and tries to add something to the teachings of the Word of God. John wants us to beware of thinking that there is truth greater than the truth of Christ”.
GP you yourself said these deceivers do not have God. You went on further to say that if they add, and i would submit, subtract, these people are decievers and are LOST when it comes to the doctrine of Christ.
I would therefore submit to you, that these persons (decievers) do not have God (you admitted this also) and are LOST, which is contrary to what Techie had said.
Dr. GP, I hope this is not far from your myopic mind. The prognosis here does seem positive in my view
Anon
I made the point that “No where does the Scripture teach that those who wrongly divide the word are lost”. because you are NOT lost because you wrongly divide the Word per se, you are lost because you do not recieve Christ. THE NT ALWAYS TEACHES THAT RECIEVING OR KNOWING OR HAVING FAITH IN CHRIST IS THE MEANS OF SALVATION. NEVER DOES IT TEACH THAT KNOWLEDGE OR IGNORANCE OF THE WORD IS THE MEANS OF SALVATION.
Nor does the proof texts on the division of thwe Word teah this. 2 Tim 2 :15 was adreesed to believers (or to a believer Timothy.)
You do not understand either the context or content of 2 John I will not contend further with you on this except to say the point in 2 John is about not having Christ. This is the central tenet of Johannine theology i.e what a person believes about Christ
You cannot rightly divide the Word without the Spirit of God. You only get the Spirit of God when you get Christ, so the issue in 2 John is about not having Christ, not dividing the Word.
The unbelievers of whom John speaks do not have God because they do not have or believe the doctine of or about Christ- not primarily because they do not divide the Word rightly. Unbelievers cannot divide the Word rightly. I would think that John knew that, dont you? You may now return to your run and read what you wrote before trying to contradict me with your stupid semantics. Read the text properly in its context.
The issue is not whether Martin Luther King can change anything (he can’t, he’s dead) but it is the cynical exploitation of King’s legacy to attack Obama. I do not believe Beck when he claims that he did not know or remember that he was holding his rally at the same place and on the anniversary of King’s “I have a dream” speech. Contrary to your low opinion of King, Beck and Palin well recognize King’s place in the political philosophy of the USA and are actually paying homage to it as they attempt (in their minds) an irrefutable attack on Obama. By associating with King’s legacy the charge of racism would be blunted. Mention of God and the Biblical tenets are hypocritically invoked to provide a cover for the real goal of achieving political power. Your “hero” Beck does not publicly dismiss King’s legacy but actually seeks to align King’s name and message with his (Beck’s) cause. Anyone believing that Beck and company are sincerely calling for America to turn to God could only be pathetically naive.
Anonymous my friend
The issue is not whether Martin Luther King can change anything (he can’t, he’s dead) ON THAT WE AGREE LOL.
but it is the cynical exploitation of King’s legacy to attack Obama. SO THEN BECK IS SMARTER THAN WE THINK HE IS LOL
I do not believe Beck when he claims that he did not know or remember that he was holding his rally at the same place and on the anniversary of King’s “I have a dream” speech. YOU MAY BE RIGHT HE SAID HE TOOK A YEAR TO PLAN THE RALLY THIS WEEK HE ASSERTED THAT HE BROUGHT SHARKTON ON HIS SHOW AND THAT HE FOLLOWED SHARKTON’s IDEAS TO DO THE RALLY SUCESSFULLY LOL SEEMS HE IS SMARTER THAN I THINK HE IS LOL!
Contrary to your low opinion of King ( FOR WHICH I RESERVE THE RIGHT) , Beck and Palin well recognize King’s place in the political philosophy of the USA and are actually paying homage to it as they attempt (in their minds) an irrefutable attack on Obama. By associating with King’s legacy the charge of racism would be blunted
SO THEN WE MUST ADMIT THAT HE IS SMARTER THAN WE THINK HE IS LOL
Mention of God and the Biblical tenets are hypocritically invoked to provide a cover for the real goal of achieving political power.
SO THEN WE MUST ADMIT THAT HE IS SMARTER THAN WE THINK HE IS LOL
SEEMS HE IS WISE AS A SERPENT WHILE APPEARING TO BE AS HARMLESS AS A DOVE. MARTIN OUGHT TO HAVE LEARNED THAT LOL. HE MIGHT HAVE ACHIEVED MORE. Some one said he died for black people. Now you got a BLACK PRESIDENT and what?
Re Your “hero” Beck does not publicly dismiss King’s legacy but actually seeks to align King’s name and message with his (Beck’s) cause. Anyone believing that Beck and company are sincerely calling for America to turn to God could only be pathetically naive.
LOL
Sir CHRIST IS MY ONLY HERO HE ONLY IS WORTHY!
You really think that Beck is my hero or that I think that America will return to God? I dont. I think they are far down the wicket. But Beck et all have the right to try to seek God’s face as taught in 2 Chron 7:14.
I cant judge their sincerity, nor can you.
If they are not sincere God will not hear their plea.
Personally I want to see America go down the hill. OK? And I dont care who the President is- whether he is black or white. I have not recieved any great benefit because the President is black Sir. Nor have many blacks.
How many black advisors does he have Sir?
The black President you are ranting and raving about has not done anything for BLACKS. He has made Health care less accessible to blacks for one. You guys are so funny on BU.
This racial stuff. We came and found it we will go and leave it BECAUSE WE BLACKS JUST TALK. WE DON’T DO ANYTHING TO IMPROVE THINGS AMONG OURSELVES. LOL Ah lie?
Terence M. Blackett, the Bar Raiser wrote at September 2, 2010 at 12:28 PM |
You wrote:- “NO PROPHET IS ACCEPTED IN HIS OWN COUNTRY OR ELSEWHERE FOR THAT MATTER!!!”
APPARENTLY IN THE USA THEY ARE ACCEPTING THE WORD OF BECK THE STUPID WHITE HICKIES MAN LOL
The Bar Raiser asked Will Glenn Beck’s Creepy “Black Robe Regiment” Use Churches to Sway Voters?
THEY PROBABLY WILL! IN FACT THEY HAVESARTED IN SOME QUARTERS.
In my church Group politics is neer mentioned. They speak only of CHRIST!
Terence M. Blackett | September 2, 2010 at 11:52 AM wrote
Just slightly OFF-TOPIC* but look at the RELIGIOUS RIGHT’s MAJOR Concerns: MONEY* –
I WONDER IF BLACKS IN THE USA AND BARBADOS DONT HAVE MONEY AS A MAJOR CONCERN
My father used to Say Money is only a problem when you dont have any! Powerful STUFF!!! LOL
ASK BLACKS IN THE USA TODAY. THIR LOT HAS NOT CHANGED WITH A BLACK PRESIDENT. Tell me that a lie here. But be correct. Show me how LOL
Black Americans did not get much of the Stimlus money did they? LOL
Techie made the point that “No where does the Scripture teach that those who wrongly divide the word are lost”
@ Anon…
You are attributing a quote to me that I DID NOT make sir!!
Pleas read again!!
What is One is All, All is One. From Ra comes the Light and Energy, that is Life.
We must not argue of disparity, but unity. Love is that which brings us to Ra.
Too much energy is on Negative, not enough on Positive.
@Techie
Sorry Sir, it was GP who made the statement.
@GP
My point is that a person who does not have God is LOST.
2Jn 1:9 says a person who does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God.
It therefore follows that those who are not correctly dividing the Word are therefore not abiding in the doctrine of Christ, and are LOST.
Maybe it is my interpretation of what the *doctrine of Christ* means is flawed. I am thinking that it refers to the teachings of Christ, and not merely the incarnation of Christ. This phrase was also mentioned at Heb 6:1, and it is referred to as the Principles of the doctrine of Christ.
I don’t think one can hold onto that fact that Jesus was God in the flesh, and yet don’t expect to abide by his teachings.
What i’m saying is that persons can sit down and read the Word of God, and come up with the wrong conclusions, and therefore be LOST in that attained ignorance.
Examples:
1. If I were a stranger to Barbados, and I bought a map in order to travel around the island, yet my interpretation of that map was incorrect. Don’t you think i might end up LOST?
2. Jesus thought, as I have read it, that tithing was part of the law. It should therefore be done away with. Almost all the churches that i know of have read the same passage of scripture, yet churches continue to teach this as part of the doctrine.
Don’t you think these persons might be lost, since they have transgressed, and are not abiding in the doctrine of Christ?
It is therefore not limited to those who *do not have, or do not believe* (if i may quote you), because believers are not dividing the word correctly, and are therefore lost in some respects.
“You may now return to your run and read what you wrote before trying to contradict me with your stupid semantics”.
I am not trying to contradict what you have written, because all that you have written is quite correct. I am just trying to show you the extent to which the passage can be interpreted.
The issue is not whether Martin Luther can change anything , He can’t he is dead.
The same can be applied to Jesus (lol).Even though these two men are dead there messages live on in the hearts and men of those who believe in their message. Yes both men have brought needed change to the world at large. The stories attributed to both men have brought extraordinary. Maybe god does move in mysterious ways.
I think all yuh bobbleheads and teachers of the Word need to clearly define the word Lost in its proper context. Before everbody reading the comments become lost in translation. The Teachers and the divider of the word need to Speak in English instead of Holy Ghost verbage. The are many ways in which the word LOST can be use and also interpreted.
e.g. If the sheep are lost the shep[herd looks for them.
if a person is given incorrect directions they would get LOST
Apparently here on Bu some of the commentators are also Lost and The Teachers are having a hard time finding them. Shame on You!
Anon | September 2, 2010 at 6:02 PM |
My point is that a person who does not have God is LOST. TRUE
2Jn 1:9 says a person who does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. ALSO TRUE BECAUSE THESE GUYS NEVER HAD GOD IN THE FIRST PLACE THEY ARE FALSE! see below
It therefore follows that those who are not correctly dividing the Word are therefore not abiding in the doctrine of Christ, and are LOST. NO! SUCH A PERSON MIGHT HAVE RECIEVED CHRIST AS SAVIOUR AND IS THUS NOT LOST.
He might be wrongly dividing the Word because he has not learned to do so, or he is following denominational dogma. He might be following what his denomination teaches on a subject. But IF he has at some time truly received Christ as Savior. he can never be Lost c f John 6:37 John 10: 27-30 etc
I see what you are trying to say but you got off at the wrong exit! LOL You seem to have a definition problem.
Re I don’t think one can hold onto that fact that Jesus was God in the flesh, and yet don’t expect to abide by his teachings. RIGHT!
Re What i’m saying is that persons can sit down and read the Word of God, and come up with the wrong conclusions, and therefore be LOST in that attained ignorance
Lost in ignorance BUT NOT LOST IN THE SPIRITUAL SENSE
NOT IF THEY HAVE GENUINELY RECEIVED CHRIST AS SAVIOR
It seems your definition of LOST is not the Biblical one. In the NT lost remains apart from God heading for hell condemned damned . If you genuinely received Christ as Savior you cant be LOST ever, even if you lose your way.
Examples:
1. If I were a stranger to Barbados, and I bought a map in order to travel around the island, yet my interpretation of that map was incorrect. Don’t you think i might end up LOST? YES But that’s not what is addressed in the NT by the word lost.
We have to chose our analogies carefully when teaching the Word.
2. Jesus thought, as I have read it, that tithing was part of the law. It should therefore be done away with. Almost all the churches that i know of have read the same passage of scripture, yet churches continue to teach this as part of the doctrine.
ACTUALLY THE NT SEEMS TO TEACH THAT YOU MIGHT GIVE MORE LOL cf 2 Corinthians 8 &9 Now you give as much as you can might be more than 10% Now you give not be cause you are ordered to i.e AS A DUTY
Now you give because you WANT TO AS A DEVOTION
Don’t you think these persons might be lost, since they have transgressed, and are not abiding in the doctrine of Christ? NO
THE DOCTRINE OF CHRIST is really the doctrine ABOUT Christ according to the Greek It MAY BE SUMMARISED THUS OK
HIS VIRGIN BIRTH
HIS VIRTUOUS LIFE
HIS VICARIOUS SUFFERING
HIS VICTORIOUS RESSURECTION
HIS VINDICATIVE ASCENSION
HIS VITAL SESSION
HIS VISIBLE RETURN
Now you tend to learn these things after you are saved.
True believers can never be lost according to Scriptures like John 6:37 Phil 1:6 Jude 24 and many such verses
dividing the word correctly is another issue altogether
Many great believers and teachers of the Word debate certain scriptures but they are not lost once they believe the doctrine of or about Christ.
Hope this helps.
But I now understand where you are coming from . You have to get a few definitions correct that’s all.
From the above comments
I herefore summarize as such after giving mnuch thought and waddling through the bowl of of the written word as decipher by the anointed one GP
As such as i. If a person received Christ and henceforth divides the Word such a person is not Lost
2. Caution ; A person who divides the Word is called a false teacher and is not known of God.
3 . There is a feeling of being hopelessly Lost in the two answers
Licks gine share now.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/europe/09/02/hawking.god.universe/index.html?hpt=Sbin
@ Dr. GP
You wrote in a comment:- “To confess that Jesus Christ is come in flesh is to own that He pre-existed as God before He became flesh.’
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………
Would you please expand on that statement, I’m not quite sure if I have understood it correctly.
Mr Hood
John 1; John 3 and much of John, Colossians 1 & 1 John 2:;28 et secq express the fact that Jesus existed as God prior to his first advent to earth (see also the majestic verses in Philipians 2: 6-8 on the kenosis and epistatic union!)
Throughout John ‘s Gospel John continually reprts that Jesus came from above. In other words he was always God, whome we are taught in John 4 is spirit.
John stresses Jesus’ coming in the flesh or his incarnation in 1 John and 2 John and Paul stresses it in 1 Timothy 3:16
Hebrews stresses 2 the imoportance of his becoming a man . He had to become the GOD MAN so that he could be the perfect go between or kinsman redeemer as required by the Law in Leviticus and as demonstrated in the book of Ruth.
Hope this helps. Jesus coming in the flesh has to do with HIS VIRGIN BIRTH . In this way he was not born in sin or with a sin nature as Adam’s offspring (see the comparison in Romans 5, and note the “much more’s ” in that chapter. We could go on.
So let us try to follow GP logic.
******************************************************
*a person who does not have God is LOST.
*a person who does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God.
*only through the guidance of the spirit of God can God’s word be correctly divided
*******************************************************
THEREFORE
-The inability to divide doctrine correctly would suggest that the person does NOT have the benefit of Gods’ spirit
- Not having Gods’ spirit indicates that one does NOT have God and is therefore lost.
‘Abiding in the doctrine of Christ’ is difficult when one cannot come to grips with his expressed reason for speaking in parables; his being the ‘firstborn of many brethren’; or his symbolic selection of ‘fisherman-types’ as disciples – rather than scholars, preachers, and lawyers.
So Hood if you agree that he came from above as the several NT Scriptures attest and born of a virgin as certain OT Scriptures prdicted then you must agre that he was previously God.
This position was vindicated by his resurrection and ascension (these two events being referred to his exaltation or being lifted up cf Isaiah 52-53 and John 3:14, John 7 John 8 and John 12 Philipians 2: 11 Revelation 5
@GP
to the high most anointed one and Medical Doctor.
Can you please explain to me the Virgin Birth ! Like what is a Virgin Birth..
Anyone with such knowledge can also respond.
@GP
Comparing Beck to MLK a man who spent a significant part of his life fighting for the rights of minorities is disrespectful to his legacy. MLK is a man who motivated Rosa Parks to protest in a way she otherwise would not have done. MLK motivated Black people in America to boycott the public transportation for 1 year and to walk instead.
Beck has just come to dinner and his message is designed to promote a divided America. Remember Jim Jones had a big following.
Let us agree to disagree, Beck like Limbaugh is a jackass and a johnny come lately, a real nut job!
@BUSH TEA
The only problem with your analogy it that according to the anointed one GP . in one of his post sept.2.6.02p.m.a person having receives christ is not lost if he divides the Word.
@ Dr.GP
So, Doc, are you, in fact, saying that God-the Father, and Jesus Christ-God the Son, are actually one and the same person?
No i cannot agree that Jesus came from above . First I need to understand fully where is”ABOVE” and what is it in reference to 1.e place.. Then again if the bible says No man has seen God. Wouldn’t that be a contradiction to say Jesus is God in the Flesh.
@ David
You wrote:- “Beck has just come to dinner and his message is designed to promote a divided America.”
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………
And why would you so claim, David? Are you saying then that Beck has ulterior motives (personal agenda?)?
@de Hood
So, Doc, are you, in fact, saying that God-the Father, and Jesus Christ-God the Son, are actually one and the same person?
No Sir I am saying that they are two different persons.
If you read John’s Gospel through this will become very clear.
@Hood
What real importance does Beck message have to all people worlwide colour , race or creed . MLK Message was about the social ills as well asw the injustices and was not linked to any political Party of that time.
Beck is linked to a political Party therfore giving people the suspicion that he is highly charged and politically motivated and he is using a tool constantly used by the rightwinged 1.e the Bible to activate his agenda.
MLK set out to make a difference and in so doing he left himself a message and him being an example for others to follow.Not everyone called upon to do exceptional things. Not everyone has the guts or intestinal fortitude to die for what is right. Mlk did.
Can glenn Beck. I think not. His as you can clearly see is will be always a one time event. Whereas Mlk continued to march and fought to make life a lot tolerant for their children and gran children not matter what colour race or creed.
@GP
So why would you refered to Jesus Christ as GOD in your post
SEpt 2/10.04p.m. You can’t have it both ways.
@ GP
I will draw your focus as to why I said you are short-sighted in this matter earlier.
We are arguing for the same coin, you for one side, and I the other.
Here is why:
Your argument holds that a person who is truly a Christian can not be lost because they believe in the doctrine of Christ. (TRUE)
My argument is that there are Christians who do not hold these views because they might not believe for example that Jesus was God and later became man, or in HIS VIRGIN BIRTH. (ALSO TRUE)
With these views in mind, the scripture at 2 jn speaks to those who do not believe.
In the final analysis therefore I submit that the scripture does speak to the fact that if one *wrongly divide the word you are lost*.
You, however, made the statement that “No where does the Scripture teach that those who wrongly divide the word are lost”
@GP
Are you seeing more clearly now, or do I need to prescribe those concave lens, Sir.
@ac who asked ”September 2, 2010 at 10:05 PM | @GP
to the high most anointed one and Medical Doctor.
Can you please explain to me the Virgin Birth ! Like what is a Virgin Birth..
Anyone with such knowledge can also respond”
———
Fairly easy to answer. You know on the condom packet where it says to ensure that one does not touch the woman before placing the condom? Well that is proof that without entrance, the possibility of seeding is there. Hence, a virgin birth may occur if foreplay occurs but no further, or if ‘events’ occur without protection, but for some reason are not carried through.
See how easy, ?
And no special knowledge required, not even having to divide anything, neother words nor legs.
Though I am not sure how one can ‘wrongly divide’ legs…
Not to belabour the point of virgin birth, but such could also ostensibly occur where youngsters play behind the bicycle shed, young buck and doe-eyed sweet girl too scared to tell daddy that the have done the bouncy-bouncy.
Or, in the old days, where a king espies a young lass and wraps her in his warm and sweaty embrace, the parents must convince the village that the baby has come without any initial ‘entry’ of their maiden.
Crusoe
Whereas your ruminations on the concept of the Virgin Birth is quite amusing, they are however, theologically incorrect. LOL
Mr Anon
Re
Your argument holds that a person who is truly a Christian can not be lost because they believe in the doctrine of Christ. (TRUE)
But your argument that there are Christians who do not hold these views because they might not believe for example that Jesus was God IS FALSE!
By definition Christians believe that Jesus is God. This is the major argument in all Johanine theology – especially 1 John . It is also the point John is making in 2 John
@GP
I knew you would hold onto that.
The bible has therefore referred to them as deceivers.
I think you can agree we are in the same church though we were in different pews.
What has been happening to the Church from its inception, is that persons are not just deceiving from without, but they are deceiving from within.
Yes Indeed Anon. This was predicted by Paul in his address to the Ephesian elders as recorded in Acts 20:32 et secq. Note also the emphasis Paul put on the Word in verse 32
28. Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
29. For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
30. Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.
31. Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.
32. And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified.
@GP
@de Hood
‘”No Sir I am saying that they are two different persons.
If you read John’s Gospel through this will become very clear.’”
**************************************
Pheeewww! I’m sure glad that we at least agree on that one!
@ac
Hi ac. I just saw on the “Suggestions Page” where you were trying to “conspire” with David to get b’day greetings sent to me. Seems that it did not pan out. Good practice for next year though!
Many thanks for trying anyhow.
@dehood.
I ain’t no rainmaker.However i did sound the bell and it wasup to the BUfamily to respond. Shame on them! smooch ! luv yuh mas!
@Crusoe..
Good try. Using condom would have been abomination and punishable by death as that would deny the w oman the God given right to have a child. However the men had the right to spill their seed on the ground
@GP
Since I have not been offically expelled from your classvia Bu. I am still expecting answers from you on my Questions. A good teacher never abandons his students.. Like Jesus says The good shepherd looks atttends after his sheep and if one is LOST he seeks after it and brings it home. You must practice what you preach. .Some sheep are wayward and hard to control.Even Zoe understands that. He never gives up on those who are Lost. Now you see to be Christ like is not easy. I expect better from you.
Believe.
It is that simple and that good.
Many Christians don’t get beyond this.
John 3:16
King James Version
For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
The concept is also expressed in the Hymn, “Amazing Grace”.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazing_Grace
I am reading and enjoying GP’s verbalization and sharing of the Word with the world.
It is powerful and strengthening.
Not many Christians get there.
Thank you GP for the edification and BU for providing the forum.
Thanks John.
I am happy that at least one person is benefitting from my weak efforts to teach the Word on BU.
On BU the ground is stony ground or BEDROCK, according to the Greek for the word translated “stony ground” in the parable.
HERE’S MARTIN* ON – “Love in Action” (for all those still choose to misunderstand the basic tenets of MLK’s philosophy and would like to argue to the sake of argument)…
“One of the great tragedies of life is that men seldom bridge the gulf between practice and profession, between doing and saying. A persistent schizophrenia leaves so many of us tragically divided against ourselves. On the one hand, we proudly profess certain sublime and noble principles, but on the other hand, we sadly practice the very antithesis of those principles. How often are our lives characterized by a high blood pressure of creeds and an anemia of deeds? We talk eloquently about commitment to the principles of Christianity, and yet our lives are saturated with the principles of paganism. We proclaim our devotion to democracy, but we sadly practice the very opposite to the democratic creed. We talk passionately about peace, and at the same time we assiduously prepare for war. We make our fervent pleas for the high road of justice, and then we thread unflinchingly the low road of injustice. This strange dichotomy, this agonizing gulf between the ought and the is, represents the tragic theme of man’s earthly pilgrimage.”
“The potential beauty of human life is constantly made ugly by man’s ever-recurring song of retaliation… Contrast a society that is even less prone to forgive. Society must have standards, norms and mores. It must have its legal checks and judicial restraints. Those who fall below the standard and those who disobey the laws are often left in the dark abyss of condemnation and have no hope of a second chance. Ask an innocent young lady, who, after a moment of overriding passion, becomes the mother of an illegitimate child. She will tell you that society is slow to forgive. Ask a public official, who, in a moment’s carelessness, betrays the public trust. He will tell you that society is slow to forgive. Go to any prison and ask the inhabitants, who have written shameful lines across the pages of their lives. From behind the bars they will tell you that society is slow to forgive. Make your way to death row and speak with the tragic victims of criminality. As they prepare to make their pathetic walk to the electric chair, their hopeless cry is that society will not forgive. Capital punishment is society’s final assertion that it will not forgive.”
“Such is the persistent story of mortal life. The oceans of history are made turbulent by the ever-rising tides of revenge. Man has never risen above the injunction of the Lex Talionis: “Life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.” In spite of the fact that the law of revenge solves no social problems, men continue to follow its disastrous leading. History is cluttered with the wreckage of nations and individuals that pursued this self-defeating path.”
“Jesus eloquently affirmed from the cross a higher law. He knew that the old eye-for-an-eye philosophy would leave everyone blind. He did not seek to overcome evil with evil. He overcame evil with good. Although crucified by hate, he responded with aggressive love.”
“What a magnificent lesson! Generations will rise and fall; men will continue to worship the god of revenge and bow before the altar of retaliation; but ever and again this noble lesson of Calvary will be a nagging reminder that only goodness can drive out evil and only love can conquer hate.”
“A second lesson comes to us from Jesus’ prayer on the cross. It is an expression of Jesus’ awareness of man’s intellectual and spiritual blindness. “They know not what they do,” said Jesus. Blindness was their trouble; enlightenment was their need. We must recognize that Jesus was nailed to the cross not simply by sin but also by blindness. The men who cried, “Crucify him,” were not bad men but rather blind men. The jeering mob that lined the roadside which led to Calvary was composed not of evil people but of blind people. They knew not what they did. What a tragedy! History reverberates with testimonies of this shameful tragedy. Centuries ago a sage named Socrates was forced to drink hemlock. The men who called for his death were not bad men with demonic blood running through their veins. On the contrary, they were sincere and respectable’ citizens of Greece. They genuinely thought that Socrates; was an atheist because his idea of God had a philosophical depth that probed beyond traditional concepts. Not badness but blindness killed Socrates. Saul was not an evil-intentioned man when he persecuted Christians. He was a sincere, conscientious devotee of Israel’s faith. He thought he was right He persecuted Christians, not because he was devoid of integrity, but because he was devoid of enlightenment. Christians who engaged in infamous persecutions and shameful inquisitions were not evil men but misguided men. The churchmen who felt that they had an edict from God withstand the progress of science, whether in the form of Copernican revolution or a Darwinian theory of natural selection, were not mischievous men but misinformed me. And so Christ’s words from the cross are written in sharp-etched terms across some of the most inexpressible tragedies of history: ‘They know not what they do’.”
“This tragic blindness expresses itself in many ominous wars in our own day. Some men still feel that war is the answer to the problems of the world. They are not evil people. On the contrary, they are good, respectable citizens whose ideas are robed in the garments of patriotism. They talk of brinkmanship and a balance of terror. They sincerely feel that a continuation of the arms race will be conducive to more beneficent than maleficent consequences. So they passionately call for bigger bombs, larger nuclear stockpiles, and faster ballistic missiles.”
“Wisdom born of experience should tell us that war is obsolete. There may have been a time when war served as a negative good by preventing the spread and growth of an evil force, but the destructive power of modern weapons eliminates even the possibility that war may serve as a negative good. If we assume that life is worth living and that man has a right to survival, then we must find an alter-native to war. In a day when vehicles hurtle through outer space and guided ballistic missiles carve highways of death through the stratosphere, no nation can claim victory in war. A so-called limited war will leave little more than a calamitous legacy of human suffering, political turmoil, and spiritual disillusionment. A world war—God forbid!—will leave only smouldering ashes as a mute testimony of a human race whose folly led inexorably to untimely death. Yet there are those who sincerely feel that disarmament is an evil and international negotiation is an abominable waste of time. Our world is threatened by the grim prospect of atomic annihilation because there is still too many who know not what they do.”
“Notice, too, how the truth of this text is revealed in race relations. Slavery in America was perpetuated not merely by human badness but also by human blindness. True, the causal basis for the system of slavery must to a large extent be traced back to the economic factor. Men convinced themselves that a system which was so economically profitable must be morally justifiable. They formulated elaborate theories of racial superiority. Their rationalizations clothed obvious wrongs in the beautiful garments of righteousness. This tragic attempt to give moral sanction to an economically profitable system gave birth to the doctrine of white supremacy. Religion and the Bible were cited to crystallize the status quo. Science was commandeered to prove the biological inferiority of the Negro. Even philosophical logic was manipulated to give intellectual credence to the system of slavery. Someone formulated the argument of the inferiority of the Negro according to the framework of an Aristotelian syllogism:
‘All men are made in the image of God; God, as everyone knows, is not a Negro; therefore, the Negro is not a man’.”
“So men conveniently twisted the insights of religion, science, and philosophy to give sanction to the doctrine of white supremacy. Soon this idea was embedded in every textbook and preached in practically every pulpit. It became a structured part of the culture. And men then embraced this philosophy, not as the rationalization of a lie, but as the expression of a final truth. They sincerely came to believe ‘ that the Negro was inferior by nature and that slavery was ordained by God. In 1857, the system of slavery was given its greatest legal support by the deliberations of the Supreme Court of the United States in the Dred Scott decision. The Court affirmed that the Negro had no rights which the white man was bound to respect. The justices who rendered this decision were not wicked men. On the contrary, they were decent and dedicated men. But they were victims of spiritual and intellectual blindness. They knew not what they did. The whole system of slavery was largely perpetuated by sincere though spiritually ignorant persons.”
“This tragic blindness is also found in racial segregation, the not-too-distant cousin of slavery. Some of the most vigorous defenders of segregation are sincere in their beliefs and earnest in their motives. Although some men are segregationists merely for reasons of political expediency and economic gain, not all of the resistance to integration is the rear-guard of professional bigots. Some people feel that their attempt to preserve segregation is best for themselves, their children, and their nation. Many are good church people, anchored in the religious faith of their mothers and fathers. Pressed for a religious vindication for their conviction, they will even argue that God was the first segregationist. ‘Red birds and blue birds don’t fly together’, they contend. Their views about segregation, they insist, can be rationally explained and morally justified. Pressed for a justification of their belief in the inferiority of the Negro, they turn to some pseudo-scientific writing and argue that the Negro’s brain is smaller than the white man’s brain. They do not know, or they refuse to know, that the idea of an inferior or superior race has been refuted by the best evidence of the science of anthropology. Great anthropologists, like Ruth Benedict, Margaret Mead, and Melville J. Herskovits, agree that, although there may be inferior and superior individuals within all races, there is no superior or inferior race. And segregationists refuse to acknowledge that science has demonstrated that there are four types of blood and that these four types are found within every racial group. They blindly believe in the eternal validity of an evil called segregation and the timeless truth of a myth called white supremacy. What a tragedy! Millions of Negroes have been crucified by conscientious blindness. With Jesus on the cross, we must look lovingly at our oppressors and say, ‘Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do’.”