Submitted by Yardbroom
As the bombs rain down on the heads of women and children in Gaza…over 460 Palestinians have been killed, to be fair as well as Hamas fighters. One is tempted to ask when will it all end, but before that question is answered we should ask ourselves when did it begin…I will not venture into Biblical history. I am also aware of the Hamas rockets fired on the Israeli cities including Sderot and Ashkelon.
Regardless of the rights and wrongs of the situation –human beings are being killed – what cannot be denied is that after the Second World War the world disgusted with themselves for the treatment the Jews suffered, sometimes with the acquiesce of some world powers and silence from others. Sought to redress the wrongs suffered by the Jews, in so doing it was the Palestinians who had to pay… and they did with their land. When the Israelis are asked how come you are entitled to these lands, they retort – God gave it to us, it is written in the Bible. They are not many people today who can show title to land they hold by reference to the Bible in a court of Law…but that is bye the bye.
That Israeli is entitled to live in peace is so obvious that is is not worth stating but so are the Palestinians.
We have had so many Palestinian “bogey men” who if they were killed or were out of the way all would be sweetness and light but they were killed or died…and there is no sweetness or light.
Do you remember Yasser Arafat, Ariel Sharon said he was an obstacle to peace and without his presence a settlement would ensue. Arafat is long dead and new fighters and leaders have taken his position. Do you remember Hamas Sheikh Ahmed Yassin the nearly blind paraplegic who was assassinated by an Israeli helicopter gunship in 2004 he was said to be an obstacle to peace he is gone and yet there is no peace.
The shrouds have been wrapped around babies and they entombed. Mothers beat their breast and wail, the bombs rain down..there is no peace.
Conflicts have been settled and the world moves on, but I fear the Israeli Palestinian conflict will “grind” on for many a year. There will be no peace for the price of that peace is an acceptance that the other side is entitled to live in peace and harmony; bold is he/her who will predict that they will see peace in their lifetime in the Holy Land…I fear I will not see it, however there are always surprises in war.
Barbados Underground 
Hopi // January 12, 2009 at 12:10 am
For all you like-minded bloggers out there, the reality on the ground is not coming out but HAMAS is kicking ass! You see the real firefight is just beginning just like Lebanon and Iraq. Remember when the big bad US ran into Iraq and the Republican Guard pulled back and pulled them into their turf and then turned up the heat on their asses, that what’s going on in Palestine now.
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Hamas kick ass?
Dream on deluded one.
The Isrealis could have squashed Hamas like a bug anytime these past 4 years . They have been restrained thats all.
Now Hamas will find out what happens when you continue to poke a sleeping Tiger.
Remember when they went into Lebanon after Hezbollah kidnapped and murdered some Israeli soldiers .
devastation followed and there hasnt been any violence from Hezbollah since.
As the current Israeli war against Hamas in Gaza continues, the worldwide propaganda assault against Israel grows exponentially. In the light of this, it’s important to review a little history about Gaza. In 2005, Israel unilaterally withdrew from Gaza and completely turned its administration over to the Palestinian Authority. All of the Jewish settlements were disbanded and their residents forcibly removed. The Israeli agricultural, commercial and residential assets – which were considerable – were left for the Palestinians.
They promptly trashed and destroyed these valuable assets that would have greatly helped them feed their own people. They were given the freedom to develop what easily could have been something like a “Hong Kong” of the Mediterranean. Many nations poured billions of dollars into the coffers of the Palestinian leadership to help them realize that dream.
Instead, the Palestinians used the money to build a terrorist army. They purchased weapons and munitions to equip that army. They smuggled into Gaza a formidable arsenal and began to launch daily attacks on Israel’s cities.
They didn’t even pretend to build an economic infrastructure that would enable the Gazan citizens to support themselves. That’s why the partial Israeli closure of the crossing points has made life so difficult for the average Palestinian. Most of them can only find work in Israel. There is none in Gaza.
Why? Because all of the economic development money was poured into terrorism. Despite this glaring fraud, the world insists on rewarding the Palestinians for their open deception.
The so-called “enlightened and responsible nations” have developed a formula for exclusive use against Israel. This formula determines under what circumstances and in what manner Israel is allowed to defend itself against terrorist attacks. First, the provocation must be many times more serious than would be necessary for other nations. Simple acts of war, such as hostage-taking or continuous missile attacks against civilian population centers, are not sufficient provocation to permit defensive measures.
Since 2005, more than 6,000 rockets have rained down on Israeli cities from Gaza. In a display of remarkable restraint, only after three years and thousands of unprovoked attacks did Israel finally feel sufficiently justified to launch a defensive response.
Now, the second phase of the anti-Israel propaganda assault kicks in. It begins almost immediately with the usual suspects – led by the Arabs, the Russians, the Muslims – all demanding an immediate Israeli withdrawal from its “invasion” of Gaza.
Right on cue, the members of the United Nations begin their usual chorus – charging that Israel’s response is “not proportionate.”
Finally, the media revs up their one-sided campaign. Their job is to spotlight the injuries and deaths of Palestinian women and children who are accidentally hit during the intense battles. Apparently, the months and years of constant bombardment lavished on the Israelis by Hamas thugs didn’t trigger the media’s interest. Only when Israel struck back did the signal go out for the mainstream media to join the fray.
In Gaza, Hamas terrorists hide in classrooms and hospital basements. They store weapons in mosques and use university laboratories for bomb-making factories. They are currently hiding long-range rockets in the basement of Gaza City’s main hospital. They intentionally place women and children on the rooftops of buildings they know will soon be targets of the Israeli air force.
Then, when these human shields are killed or wounded by Israeli fire, the media vents their outrage on the Israeli gunner or pilot, not the calculating terrorist. The bodies of dead terrorists – or their human shields – are then paraded by the ever-accommodating media as “innocent victims of Israeli aggression.” And the orchestrated calls for “proportionality” grow louder.
Following this oft-repeated formula, as the selected media images mount, the predictable demands for an unconditional Israeli cease-fire rise to a global crescendo. Moderate Western governments like France, Britain and other EU nations that have large Muslim populations begin to demand that Israel cease this “disproportionate war.” The worldwide cry grows until finally the United States is bullied into not vetoing a Security Council resolution condemning Israel as an unjustified aggressor.
This is the formula that has always worked. The Islamic fundamentalists know this formula well. Terrorist organizations like Hezbollah and Hamas have perfected the use of this formula to the point of making it a “tactic of war.” Islamic terrorists attack and fight until they begin to lose. Then the world rushes in and rescues them to fight another day.
“Proportionality” is the key word that has been especially adapted for use against Israel in order to guarantee its eventual destruction through attrition.
The historically accepted objective of defensive warfare is to eliminate an enemy’s ability to harm you. The side that does that first is the winner. And until one side has accomplished that goal, the war continues.
The one overriding goal of Hamas is the annihilation of Israel. It’s clearly spelled out in their Charter. They confirm it at every opportunity. The “enlightened nations” just can’t grasp this reality. The 6,000-plus rocket attacks against Israel were provoked by nothing more than Israel’s continued existence. As long as Israel exists, Hamas’ goal remains unfulfilled. The numerous state-supported Islamic terrorist organizations feel the same way.
On the other hand, Israel has demonstrated that it will absorb almost any blow before resorting to war. Israel’s one goal is to secure a lasting peace. To achieve that goal, Israel must eliminate the enemy’s ability to wage war. If they don’t, war will continue in perpetuity.
The U.N.’s definition of “proportionality” in the case of Israel’s self-defense means that Israeli losses must be at least equal to Palestinian losses. If Israel follows this formula, it guarantees that they will eventually loose by attrition. It guarantees that war will continue until the Muslims get strong enough to finally obliterate Israel. Just think what would have been the outcome of World War II if the same irrational thinking had been forced on the allied armies fighting against Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan.
Some argue that Hamas is just defending itself, and homemade missiles are the only weapons they have against Israeli warplanes and tanks. But Hamas is NOT defending itself against Israel when it shells Israeli cities. Israel has not occupied Gaza since its 2005 withdrawal.
However, if Hamas would cease firing rockets and sending suicide bombers into Israel, there would be no need to defend itself. The borders would be open and peace and prosperity would follow.
The indiscriminate firing of rockets into civilian population centers is internationally acknowledged as a war crime. It constitutes collective punishment under U.N. treaty law. But since it’s Hamas firing against Jewish targets, the United Nations is silent. This is just another example of how international law is more binding on Israel than any other nation on earth.
There is no other nation whose conduct is subjected to closer scrutiny by “international law experts” than Israel – the U.N. appointed them for that specific purpose. But in the case of Israel, it can be demonstrated that Israel’s enemies use U.N. international law against them.
Hamas claims its attacks are in resistance to Israel’s closing of its borders. But the reason why Israel closes its borders with Gaza are never mentioned. None of Israel’s critics ever consider that every time Israel opens its borders to Palestinian workers, a flood of suicide bombers are sent in. And when Gaza’s international borders are opened, Hamas rushes in new and more powerful rockets to fire at Israel’s cities.
What is it about Israel that makes it the world’s pariah state? How can it be that no insult to the Arabs is too slight to justify wholesale murder, whereas no atrocity, no matter how outrageous, justifies an Israeli defensive response? It matters not how reasonable and legitimate the defensive action would be for any other nation. But leaders from around the world have streamed into the U.N. to defend the “Palestinian democracy” – as if such an entity exists.
It makes absolutely no sense in the natural. Only the Bible can explain the mystery behind the supernatural hatred of the Jews. Bible prophecy predicted that Israel would be miraculously reborn in “the last days.” The Bible also predicted that a supernatural hatred against Jews would grow worldwide. This will be soon followed by Armageddon and the return of Jesus the Messiah.
All of this is being fulfilled to the letter before our eyes. So don’t be surprised or afraid. Christ’s return to deliver those who have believed in Him is coming very soon.
View the video http://www.hallindsey.com/
Are you talking about Hamas or the Palestinian civilians killed?
Are you talking about Hezbollah or the Lebanese civilians killed?
If you think that Israel can break the backs of the Palestinians or the Lebanese……….YOU must be the deluded one or your history is as warped as you mind.
Another View………I really was looking forward to another view………same old rhetoric about Propaganda .
Who is better at propaganda than the Israelis.
With no reporters allowed they are doing as they like.They are bombing UN schools with impunity and have thew gall to deny it even though high ranking UN officials are witnessing the atrocities.
Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005, yes we know that.
Did you also know that they still maintained a crippling blockade on both land and sea…FACT!!
Did you know that they still controlled the movement of the Palestinians with these illegal checkpoints….FACT!!
How can the farmers farm with a giant wall built….contrary to UN resolutions………right through their lands….FACT!!
Didn’t the IDF destroy many olive grooves maintained by the same hard working farmers, with bulldozers, just for the fun of it?
Oh…………..I really thought you had another view for real!!
Another view
without getting past the third paragraph, that thing you spouting sounds like pure propaganda. If so much money went in and nothing was done, it most likely is that nothing can be done, under the circumstances.
Palestinians may have come to the conclusion that there can be no sustainable economic activity if everytime, it is destroyed by the Israelis.
That is a lame story you telling. Why would they build small terrorists units rather than a military? Again, the answer may be cultural. An army may provide an open target and an excuse for Israeli aggression.
But for you to malign an entire nation is wicked and certainly no excuse to label Palestinians as worthless in order to commit genocide, can be plausible, ’cause you looking like you gearing up to invade Palestine too.
Q: When Jesus returns, who will he lead? the christians of today or the Jews?
Hamas stockpiling arsenals? you called rockets made in people’s backyard and having no sense of navigation stockpiling? I saw some dumbo writing in the washington post saying that instead of arming themselves hamas should have built bomb shelters.These people can hardly get food or oil(controlled by the generous and humane zionists ) and u want them to build bomb shelters.
As for human shields, if a militia with 10000 recruits build a specific compound in the area on what is called Gaza, i would have to be an idiot to do such.
Another point worth mentioning, most Jews spend time in the IDF, so technically there are soldiers .Only they dont wear uniforms.
Another view
Bravo for telling it as it is.
Re building etc
After the Israelis withdrew from the Gaza they left some state of the art greenhouses worth millions of dollars.
To the dismay and protests of the more thinking Palestinians these were looted and destroyed.
The rockets are not all built in backyards. they are smuggled from Egypt and come from Iran who is financing and supporting Hamas.
Why cant they build shelters – if they have time to build rockets they have time to build shelters.
They deliberately leave their people vulnerable.
Another view,
That Hamas is a terrorist organisation that has also committed war crimes for me is without question.
but that cannot justify war crimes in retaliation.
Your concept of proportionality is wrong. The civilian loss (or risk of loss) must be proportional to the military objectives when the IDF strikes, not a simple equality of losses.
If Hamas forces civilians to act as human shield it is a war crime. Equally it is a war crime by the IDF if they attack the said human protected site.
What do you suppose the palestinians
behave in such self destructive way?
The bible also predicts ‘babylon’ will be uninhabited save for ‘dragons’
what do you expect from uneducated bronze age writers.
christians sure are tenacious, christ has been “soon” coming for you since the time of the apostle Paul.
Th great Martin Luther was sure of his imminent arrival nearly five hundred years ago.
do you suppose that if I accuse the US of war crimes in the illegal invasion of Iraq that I hate americans?
when the IRA launched mortars from the Irish Republic into British Northern Ireland, should the brits have responded by carpet bombing Dublin ?
would that have attracted an international outcry?
if we condemned the brits would we be accused of hating the british people?
Another point worth mentioning, most Jews spend time in the IDF, so technically there are soldiers .Only they dont wear uniforms.
Not condoning the attacks on civilians but in some way the Palestinians have this warped sense of reasoning, where, because most, if not all Israeli men join the IDF at some stage in their lives, then they seem to think that most civilians are in fact IDF soldiers not in uniform……..like I said…warped.
All Gazans are taught Jihad** and the destruction of Israel** in their schools, are shown the maps *without* Israel. Does that make all Gazans Jihadis?
@ru4real? Are you for phu….g real? Long live the RESISTENCE. Resist evil, resist the SINogouge of SATAN. Press On!
Hopi – you are one sick man
You need to see a head doctor else all that hate gonna kill ya.
Thank you for trying to return a glimmer of sanity, poster of “Another View” !
It’s strange that the world at large is ignoring the fact that Hamas really has no
respect or regard for the lives of the people it is supposed to be fighting for… It is like village idiots who continually poke
match sticks into a hive of bees and then howl in pain to high heaven when the bees swarm to defend themselves stinging the guilty and unfortunately some innocent… and later the whole village says that the bees shouldn’t sting and want to have the bees exterminated!
Hamas and Hezbollah and other violent groups would seem to be wasting time, money and lives … If the masses armies of the Arab Nations could not destroy Israel in 1948, 1967 or 1973, why do these village idiots feel they have a reasonable chance? Of course they don’t…. It’s just part of their mis-guided plans to try and turn the whole world against the Israelis, a plan that seems to be working incredibly well too. The Muslims of the world understand very well what HAMAS is doing and by and large remain silent.. Just like they largely remained silent when Sunni and Shiite were killing each other by the bushel in Iraq with the suicide bombers etc.. Where were the howls of outrage and the protests then? In fact, it could be argued that the Arab Nations have allowed their Palestinian brothers to suffer and not take in more of them, as a way to keep the bad press up on Israel over the decades…
The Arabs with 200 times the population and 200 times the land mass of Israel have been trying thru violent means for 60 years to wipe out Israel and liberate Palestine, and after all that expense in lives and oil treasure what do they have to show for it? The Palestinians have less land than when Israel first returned in 1948!
Doing basically the same thing time and time again and expecting a different result is a sign of madness is it not???
To make matters worst, The extremist’s continual folly is only hurting the efforts of the more rational thinking groups who oppose Israel in far far more dangerous ways. A case in point… very recently , to my dismay, Israel appears to have banned Arab political parties from taking part in the up coming elections… that’s a bad, undemocratic thing for Israel to have done, but it is easy to understand why… Arabs tend to have a lot more children than Israelis… and if the Arabs played their cards right, given Israel’s proportional representational election system, they could conceivably become a major power player politically in Israel!
Now, thanks to Hamas, Israel has banned the vehicles which might have seen a more sympathetic Israeli leadership for the Palestinian plight. For a democratic country to ban a legitimate political party is a very bad business which I hope Israel will reverse in time to come.. else it will have terrible consequences for us all.
In my opinion, the Arabs would be well advised to abandon violent means of getting their ‘justice’ and seek unification of the West Bank and Gaza, not with each other, but with the state of Israel…. The current map doesn’t make sense… Just QUIT… All decent Arabs need to denounce Hamas and others like them.. Forget about who was right and who was wrong… who killed who ..let the dead remain dead and stop joining them. Quit hating … Embrace democracy and use that as a vehicle to obtain their due and try to live in peace with the Jews.. and in 100 years this Arab /Israel conflict would be a distant memory , and Israel might well have more Muslims in it that Jews…
You may think I’m foolish, ignorant or mad (or all three)… but what’s the harm for them to try it? Surely it can’t be any worst that what’s happening now….
And no, don’t think that I’m ignoring that some Jews are every bit as violent as Hamas and Co… and need to be denounced as well. After all, what do you expect? Hitler made sure all the weaker Jews didn’t make it… talk about survival of the fittest…
We black people here in Barbados are survivors of slavery…. What our forefathers went thru could be compared to the suffering of the Palestinians to a degree, yet we live in the same land as the descendants of the whites who enslaved
our forefathers… use the same roads, banks, cemeteries, hospitals and prisons.. all without killing each other.. maybe we could send our story over to the Middle East and be an example of a better (not perfect) way.
I fear time is running out… eventually some un-smart misguided extremist WILL get his fingers on a WMD, then everybody loses, September 11th will seem like a minor disturbance compared to such an occurrence and the response.
@ru4real? You could be on to something – Crack, speed, meth… something. Maybe I should see Dr.Jekyll. What do you think?
From the Daily Telegraph………….
The intensification of the ground combat saw Israeli tanks push deep into the heart of Gaza City, clashing with militants but causing controversy when Israeli forces struck the United Nations headquarters and three clearly marked hospitals.
Israel claimed militants were firing from the UN base, something that was dismissed as “nonsense” by John Ging, the chief of the UN refugee aid agency who was inside the compound when it was set alight by Israeli white phosphorus shells.
White phosphorus is a controversial material used to create a smokescreen for advancing troops. Under the rules of war it can only be used in open spaces away from large civilian populations. There have been repeated allegations in Gaza that civilians have suffered disfiguring burn injuries after being hit by white phosphorus.
Witnesses said the UN compound was set alight when it was hit by three shells. “Three white phosphorus shells have hit the compound and right now the pallets on which we are meant to deliver aid are on fire,” said Chris Gunness, the spokesman for the UN Relief and Works agency.
“What more powerful symbol can there be than pallets used for aid being set alight by the fighting? With white phosphorus you cannot put out the flames with water. You need sand and right now there is too much fighting for our staff to get sand.”
Israeli forces advanced further than ever before, their tanks powering into the southern suburb of Tel el Howa. The tanks advanced under a barrage of artillery and mortar fire that struck the al Quds, al Fata and al Wafa hospitals.
There were unconfirmed reports that Shifa, Gaza City’s biggest hospital, was on fire after being struck by Israeli shells.
We write, we analyse, we argument, we discuss. Emotion, resentment, points-of-view are poured out to what end.
Chirs Halsall wrote, with the same responsibility to accept questions at face value, and answers with honesty. Importantly, “I don’t know” is always an acceptable and honourable answer.
@All…
I’m finding the word “Why” very interesting at the moment. For what that’s worth.
@ those who responded to Chris
He said he is finding the word “Why” very interesting at the moment. I am, my question is Why did you defend his words?
He openly wrote ‘with the same responsibility to accept questions at face value, and answers with honesty.
How can you accept questions of face value when those face value questions have been distorted by others to look and feel like the truth.. Chris talks about ‘answers with honesty. How honestly, has this situation been assessed by all. Who’s words are been used and how is that knowledge obtained and digressed.
My view is to defend anyone who kills many or one in the name of a higher spiritual being is cowardice. They use this method to justify what they are doing is righteous, taking the responsibility from themselves and calling it for the Greater Good.
It is not about ‘Why’ because the why is apparent, but Chris is about ‘Who are killing?’ How they are Killing? When will it end?
Chris will it not be better to examine the words or questions or sentences with the Who, How and the When?
The ones that can stop, do they want to stop? (The Who)
Will the ones want a resolution?(The How)
Can they be stopped? (The When)
And lastly Chris wrote that “I don’t know” is always an acceptable and honourable answer. Hummm, is it .. If we continually said I don’t know, will any discussion or trading of conversations take place on this site? If you don’t know you would not comment. What I am saying is, if you know about a subject in depth or not your comment is still valid as something in what you say might trigger a thought process in someone else or even a solution to this fight. If you don’t know about a subject in it’s entirety you would not even be blogging about it.
So to say that “I don’t know” is always an acceptable and honourable answer is this comment true in this situation?
Very selective nuh!
“I don’t know” is an acceptable and truthful answer if you don’t know and honourable if you don’t know what to say, or how else to respond.
some things you should know
bombing a hospital is wrong
bombing the UN headquarters is wrong
lest I be accused of anti semitism
firing rockets which risk civilian life is also wrong
@Care…
Wow. I’m not quite sure how to respond to your above. But please forgive me for trying…
It is, in my mind, a truism that no one *knows* anything.
So, as a deduction, one should accept all statements at face value.
This is not to be interpreted to mean that all statements are true, however.
Some statements *might* be true, and should be considered more deeply.
Other statements, on the other hand, are demonstrably silly (read: stupid), and can be rejected until further substantial arguments are presented.
To close: a curse: “May you live in interesting times…
Israel is no fool.
They know what they are doing , they are well organized.
First they massacre all these women and children then they claim it only to be collateral damage.
Mistake
Mistake they say
1st time, then 2nd time, then 3rd time, then 4th time 5th 6th 7th 8th…
but by now the entire world begins to catch on they are playing a game with the world.
Dont you see , the positions these Zionist hold in the US, do you know what they control . They are the biggest propagandist in this world today. They control what you see, read and hear.
They expect all brothers and sisters of the innocent dead to grow up one day with only one mission in life, TO KILL THE MURDERERS OF THEIR FAMILY.
But now everything will be “peaceful” . This will be their chance to fool the world that they are only defending themselves. Now that will lead to a bitter war one that was never seen in history .
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